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as "green" or "red" or as Jew or Aryan was made by the SS, and for me it had no binding validity. QFrom what date on did you work with the illegal camp administration and the political committee? AShortly after I began my activities as second camp doctor at the beginning of 1941. QKogon said the following in this matte... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,835,000 | 2,835,500 |
was informed in good time how the transport was to be made up. The illegal camp administration told me this. Then I removed most of the prisoners from the transport and said that for one reason or another they were unfit for travel, being sick. Those in particular danger, namely those who had played a political role in... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,835,450 | 2,835,950 |
and Kogon was such a person because he was not a member of the illegal committee or illegal camp administration - as I say, for a person who is not on the inside it might appear that I was helping the prisoners for corrupt reasons, That however, was by no means the case. I derived advantages personally from the prisone... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,835,900 | 2,836,400 |
because I was the director of these workshops, and I wouldn't bribe myself. No, I did not receive these things for my personal use, but as I said, I had them manufactured for the purpose of bribery in the interest of the prisoners themselves. I wouldn't be speaking of these unimportant matters now, I am not under indic... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,836,350 | 2,836,850 |
have given Kogon that opinion. Kogon cannot judge this because he never worked with me in the hospital. These can only be infounded rumors which small minds let loose in the world. Because I lived in foreign countries and lived two years in Paris, many people have concluded that I like to live a luxurious life because ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,836,800 | 2,837,300 |
characteristic features. This I know from conversations with inmates, who were much more clever and intelligent than myself and who had much more experience in life than I had. They told me that scientists, judges, ministers, high state official, priests, artists and authors, in short everyone who were the red triangle... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,837,250 | 2,837,750 |
of to occupy this position. Unfortunately, by the middle of 1942 most of the positions of Capo were occupied by these malodorous professional criminals and informers but we finally succeeded in eliminating most of them. I know many Capos who did the most prodigious and amazing things for their comrades in order to alle... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,837,700 | 2,838,200 |
would have been the correct procedure, but of course it was never followed. This I know from personal experience; an altogether primitive thing was the reason for this. The administrative heads of the protective custody camps were altogether simple, primitive people and had an education so slight you would be surprised... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,838,150 | 2,838,650 |
need for the further submission of its evidence. It will last roughly three and one-half to four days until all the supplementary material has been put in. THE PRESIDENT:Very well, counsel. MR. HARDY:Your Honor, my understanding is that the defendant Pokorny will call three witnesses here. THE PRESIDENT:Will counsel fo... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,838,600 | 2,839,100 |
by another German doctor, the fraud would certainly have been discovered and the consequences for Dr. Waldemar Hoven would have been serious." Then in Number 13 it describes the way in which he himself was released: "Dr. Waldemar Hoven visited me the same day and without making any examination whatever promised me that... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,839,050 | 2,839,550 |
necessary I sent sick patients to Jena for specialized attention. QMr. President, in substantiation of these statements I put in Document Hoven No. 17? which will be Exhibit 13. This is an affid avit by Gerhard Schiedlausky, page 56. This is an excerpt from Prosecution Document No.NO-508, which was Exhibit 135, in Trib... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,839,500 | 2,840,000 |
the underground movement (Walter Kraemer, Karl Peik), and I am able to certify this from my own observations. "I wish to state that only one transport was sent to the Bernburg gas chambers during the time of my stay in Buchenwald. The selection of these people and the compilation of lists were carried out by the 'polit... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,839,950 | 2,840,450 |
there are further statements about conditions in Buchenwald. On page 10, last paragraph, he makes statements regarding the defendant's attitude toward the Jews and says that contrary to orders of the SS camp management he treated Jewish patients. Page 12 contains further statements regarding Hoven's cooperation with th... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,840,400 | 2,840,900 |
out by the SS Dr. Hoven had maintained a connection between the individual accused prisoners and had thus exposed himself to the serious danger of getting shot. In connection with Dr. Hoven's activities, Busse said to me and to some other prisoners of the hospital, 'Waldemar--' that means Hoven '--is crazy; you could a... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,840,850 | 2,841,350 |
with criminals served the purpose of preventing the political prisoners from starting any opposition whatsoever. The whole system was characterized by the absolute lack of any rights on the side of the prisoners, the behavior of the SS Fuehrer assigned to the concentration camps, and the secrecy surrounding the concent... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,841,300 | 2,841,800 |
camp that Dr. Hoven had prevented this transportation of Jews. I know this particularly from the Jewish workmen who were laying the floor in the Gustloff Werk. Moreover, it was generally talked about in the camp that Dr. Hoven would soon be one of us because he had prevented the transportation of the Jews. "Shortly aft... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,841,750 | 2,842,250 |
know from other sources whether he was ever in the camp? A.I can only speak of the time when I was in Buchenwald until until September 1943. I never heard at any time that he had been there, and in view of the position Professor Brandt had it seems unreasonable to assume he was there. Q.I should like to ask you a quest... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,842,200 | 2,842,700 |
had with him. Q.What do you know about Ding's personal relations with Grawitz? A.Ding was a friend of Grawitz. He always liked to make friends among such important people. I know that he once told me proudly, this was in 1942, that Grawitz, on the occasion of the birth of Ding's daughter, made his automobile available ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,842,650 | 2,843,150 |
order given in the same terms as the Wehrmacht orders. As I said, this came from the Regional Induction Office and I had no choice of any branch of the service. Q.Now, Doctor, I want you to attempt to recall the interrogations of last October, wherein you and I drafted up this affidavit document, No. 429, which is at c... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,843,100 | 2,843,600 |
if that refreshes your recollection so that we can be brief here. After we had discussed the various details, I said to you; "I will go over this in detail with you. I want to get you to verify these facts for us. We will check these facts; that is in the form of an affidavit. I want to go over each section of the affi... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,843,550 | 2,844,050 |
are able to make these statements?" Referring to the Draft, and you stated, "Yes." Do you recall that I stated to you, "I want you to correct me when I read if the facts are not correct," and you answered, "I understand you." A.You mean when you were reading the English? Q.That is correct. A.Yes and as I said I certain... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,844,000 | 2,844,500 |
you were so extraordinarily polite and nice to me that you were really acting like my defense counsel and I did not think you were going to be the Prosecutor. Q.Well, now Doctor, in this course of going over the affidavit, do you recall that we went over the affidavit do you recall that we went over the affidavit to th... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,844,450 | 2,844,950 |
Genzken, Mrugowsky and Ding; is that correct? A.- Yes, as far as Block 50 is concerned, that is correct. Q.- Doctor, would it be more convenient for you to follow me in English, or would you rather follow me in German through the interpreter during the course of this interrogation concerning the affidavit? Which ever y... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,844,900 | 2,845,400 |
that sense, it is correct, if you understand it. QBy virtue of that friendship you were able to gain knowledge of some of his activities. AOn the basis of friendship formed for a certain purpose, yes. QNow, then, also at that time I asked you to write down the names of some of those inmates, that is three or four inmat... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,845,350 | 2,845,850 |
sense to put me in charge of the supervision since I did not understand anything about it. He had already given Kapo Dietzsch instructions and regarded 46 as his own domain. QWell, had you ever seen any of the experiments conducted in Block 46? ANo. QNow, Dr. Hoven, just a moment. Here in paragraph 7 I asked you or pro... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,845,800 | 2,846,300 |
the conversation with you was in the form of a conversation and when you mentioned this figure 500, I then assumed that you had more knowledge than I. And you can see that in my opinion it was really a leading question. When you named this figure to me and I let you influence me and I said "I have no information about ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,846,250 | 2,846,750 |
I assume then there were mistakes made in the translation. QI was reading what you said to me, doctor. I proposed the same paragraph which is now contained in DocumentNO-429. I read that same paragraph verbatim to you in the interrogation and after reading the paragraph you stated, "Yes", and then I read another sectio... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,846,700 | 2,847,200 |
I don't understand, Mr. Hardy. It's like this. The selection had already been made by the Gestapo or the camp administration. Q.- Then the experimental subjects were not volunteers. I am trying to convey this question to you, Doctor. When these inmates were selected to be used in experiments in Block 46, were they volu... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,847,150 | 2,847,650 |
off the list so that they would not be subjected to the experiments, did you then select other people to take their place on the list? A.- It is not correct, if you use the first person. I did not do it, but the prisoners did it, but I assumed the responsibility for the action. That is correct, - and they were exclusiv... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,847,600 | 2,848,100 |
into the hospital as patients, and whether other persons were put in their place, I don't know. Q.- Were the other 300 or 400 Jews who actually went on the transport all informers, traitors, criminals? A.- No, no; certainly not. Q.- Well, was it impossible to save them? A.- But, Mr. Hardy, I cooperated with the Jewish ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,848,050 | 2,848,550 |
reached and that was Bernburg. Therefore, I went there by car, talked to Dr. Ebel for about ten minutes, and he gave the permission and said that the corpses were to be sent there and they would burn them and then I went to this branch camp and informed them about it. Q.Was your trip to Bernburg made before or after th... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,848,500 | 2,849,000 |
it stylistically; you will note that yourself, that wasn't so simple. Q.Now, when Dr. Ding came to assist you in the operating room one evening when you were administering phenol to three inmates, did Dr. Ding come in just by chance or did he come in at your invitation, or what was the reason for Ding's presence that e... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,848,950 | 2,849,450 |
please? A.Who the prisoners were? Q.Yes. A.Kuschnir-Kuschnarev. Q.I don't mean the prisoners killed, I mean the prisoners who performed the killings. A.You just interrupted me; I just wanted to say so. I stated the reasons why I cannot tell you that, because then I would be no better than the traitors against whom I fo... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,849,400 | 2,849,900 |
of the informers-- Q.Doctor, we have known that for a considerable time. You do not feel that you wish to incriminate or tend to incriminate anyone else in this, in regard to the prisoners who assisted you? A.I didn't understand that this is incrimination. But I shall not state at that time the people who tried to impr... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,849,850 | 2,850,350 |
name them all. QThen you received orders to kill more than once from the camp commander? ANo, prisoners who had been threatened or who were in danger. I did not find that out directly, usually I found out from the trusted men and we saved them in the well-known manner by admitting them as patients or sending them to ou... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,850,300 | 2,850,800 |
that during the roll-call, the prisoners killed one of these informers by stamping on him with their feet. Of these killings, I found out afterwards and I had no influence on them. At the most, I could have denounced them to the superior authorities; the jurisdiction of the SS I considered as criminal, however, that ha... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,850,750 | 2,851,250 |
you, then I left the interrogation and Mr. DeVries interrogated you further for a short time. Did I not return the next day with the affidavit written in a formal manner and asked you to read the affidavit? AYes. QAnd in fact I read the affidavit aloud to you? AYes, you read it aloud to me. I requested you to read a li... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,851,200 | 2,851,700 |
help the prisoners as much as I was able to, and so I did. "I don't want to trouble you with all the possibilities I had to help the prisoners from 1941 to 43 September, I have many witnesses therefore and many letters. But I want to tell you that on 11th or April, 1945, when I was taken prisoner by the Americans, 3 mi... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,851,650 | 2,852,150 |
witnesses involved based on questions propounded by the defendants or defense counsel, to the questions propounded by the Prosecution. Therefore, the Prosecution does not feel that the answers gained as the result of the Commissioners while in Holland are subject to documentation and given a document and exhibit number... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,852,100 | 2,852,600 |
the whole thing, if the statement of defense counsel is true, that certain affidavits or the results of an investigation were submitted to the Tribunal as a part of the Prosecution's case, then the defendant made application to the Tribunal for the production of the afficants in person for the purpose of cross examinat... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,852,550 | 2,853,050 |
probative value and I am of the opinion since they arc questionnaires which were granted to mo on my request they cannot be submitted by the prosecution against my will. JUDGE SEBRING:That is the point, doctor. Aren't you in precisely the same situation that you would be in the case of a witness being produced here in ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,853,000 | 2,853,500 |
regard to the matter of the interrogatories under discussion before the noon recess, these interrogatories were propounded by defense counsel by way of cross examination of certain witnesses whose written statements were offered by the prosecution and received in evidence by the Tribunal. These interrogatories being, a... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,853,450 | 2,853,950 |
that you injected him in the course of an experiment at Block 46. AThat is impossible, because I never did that. QDid you ever witness the execution of Russian commissars by shooting? AOnce. QWhen was that? AI can't tell you the exact date. I was sent there on orders of the illegal camp management and the foreign polit... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,853,900 | 2,854,400 |
the pathological section. I had also to compose the so-called post-mortem findings on these prisoners who were shot on escape, which findings were distributed in numerous copies, among others also to the SS-Court in Dusseldorf." Now we will turn to the next page - page 3 and on page 3 of the English, we will find on pa... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,854,350 | 2,854,850 |
a man was in good enough condition to be beaten, was not reached by me but by prisoner nurses and the trustees of the illegal camp committee. We did. everything we could to see to it that no foreign or German political prisoners were beaten. Tha.t was our greatest success. Q.- Well then suppose a professional criminal ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,854,800 | 2,855,300 |
translation, your Honor, we note that before any prisoner can be punished the medical opinion must be given and in this case Dr. Plaza has stated, quoting from the document: "The culprit, named on the reverse side, was medically examined by me before the execution of the flogging. I do not have any objections against t... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,855,250 | 2,855,750 |
slip there? Kisiliczka? A.No, I didn't know him. Q.Did you know a man named Woidellek, Ernst W O I D E L L E K ? A.No, I can't remember that I did know him. Q.Was that man a notorious criminal in the camp? A.Could you please spell the name again? Q. W O I D E L L EK. A.I can't remember the name, at the moment. Q.Well, ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,855,700 | 2,856,200 |
tho fact that on tho front side of tho document, at the top, are certain pencil notes, will you please examine those notes and state, if you know, in whose handwriting they appear and state, if you can road tho note, what tho note says? A.I can try to explain it, Your Honors, although I cannot say for certain. I assume... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,856,150 | 2,856,650 |
German words on tho top of this document? THE PRESIDENT:You may. MR. HARDY:There's a handwritten notation. INTERPRETER:These could be the letters "v r s t r b" with a period which would be a possible abbreviation for tho German word "verstorben" which means died. Q.- Do you know whether or not this prisoner Kisiliczka ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,856,600 | 2,857,100 |
which is offered as Prosecution Exhibit 125 for identification; you will note here in this document several letters dealing with the equipment used in Block 50 and the furnishings of Block 50, and the general construction of Block 50, and in most instances it is referred to you. We note on page 3 that the letter is add... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,857,050 | 2,857,550 |
now, the entry just above that indicates that persons were infected with virus and that an experimental series was in progress on the 3rd of March, and it says: "I didn't see the results of that first experimental series until 19 March." Now, when Dr. Ding was in the hospital at Berlin, the entry 17 March states that y... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,857,500 | 2,858,000 |
Buchenwald as a prisoner. QHave you ever seen the results of your trial, that is the report written by the judges, I suppose; your trial that was held in September of 1944? AI never saw it, but the reports that were written about a Gestapo and SS trial were written up in whatever way they pleased. QWho tried you; what ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,857,950 | 2,858,450 |
side of the Prosecution. I see neither the purpose of the probative value of this document. THE PRESIDENT:Of course an indictment itself is no proof of anything, but the proceedings which follow the indictment might be of probative value. In any event, the matter of probative value of any document present in evidence m... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,858,400 | 2,858,900 |
exact date for this, I shall always remember it, 28 December, 1943, after an air attack on Frankfurt on the Main in the presence of his secretary. QLet us be more brief. AI am just getting to the main point. QJust a moment..... THE PRESIDENT:Please allow the witness to finish his answer. The witness may continue his an... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,858,850 | 2,859,350 |
is the Titz I am thinking of, who was a servant of Koch, then I can tell you he is still alive. I saw him by accident on the day when I was taken prisoner. He is still alive, he is fine. QWho is Sommer? A.He was a supervisor in the bunker? QAn SS man? AYes. QIs he one and the same Sommers who is now on trial here in Nu... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,859,300 | 2,859,800 |
of the Gestapo and it is pretty harmless in comparison with their other stuff. BY THE PRESIDENT: QWitness, returning to the subject of punishment in Buchenwald, with what instrument were these floggings administered? How was it made and of what material? AIt was a leather whip. I can't tell whether there was a steel re... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,859,750 | 2,860,250 |
between these two. Koch was the one who finally lost. Then Heydrich visited the camp and about fifty to sixty high Wehrmacht officers. JUDGE SEBRING:Who were some of them? THE WITNESS:I was not introduced to them. They had the ranks of Generals and Colonels. Also physicians of the Wehrmacht visited tho camp. As far as ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,860,200 | 2,860,700 |
myself with the problems of the prisoners mostly. We were happy if we didn't see those big shots. QWell, from what you have seen, read, or heard from various sources, can you tell us what officials had knowledge of the program of Euthanasia or the program of extermination of prisoner inmates? AI told you, Mr. Hardy, wh... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,860,650 | 2,861,150 |
tell you that from my own knowledge. I never had any. thing to do with them and didn't know them either. QThen you don't feel you are in a position to inform us as to the knowledge of the Government, Party, military, SS officials and organizations? AAs far as action 14F13 is concerned? QAnd experiments, yes. AMr. Hardy... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,861,100 | 2,861,600 |
it is a person who, because of his conviction, was an opponent of the then existing National Socialist government, either after serving a sentence which was passed by a special court or a regular court - a prison sentence or a penitentiary sentence - and who was then sent to a concentration camp. From my fairly good kn... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,861,550 | 2,862,050 |
practice, of course, the political prisoners hardly ever were released again. I personally remember a case in which it was being considered that a political prisoner, who had not done anything wrong be kept longer in the camp. Therefore it was said that he spit on the floor and. had thus endangered the health of the re... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,862,000 | 2,862,500 |
the procedure. QNow, can you state to what extent this program in actual practice was known among the officials of the Party, or the Wehrmacht, or of the SS, or of the government? In other words, was this practice pursued toward political prisoners an open secret - something that everyone knew about, generally speaking... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,862,450 | 2,862,950 |
that is of course for political reasons, was then without serving a sentence, without being sentenced by the Court, immediately returned to the concentration camp. Those prisoners had a red triangle and about this rod triangle they had a horizontal stripe, about 3 centimeters wide and 8 to 10 centimeters long. This was... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,862,900 | 2,863,400 |
women and girls who had had sexual intercourse with Jews were also supposed to be put into concentration camps and also wore the Jewish star with the same black rim. I only heard that from stories told me by the inmates. QWas this Jewish star a yellow star? AThe Jewish star in the case of the political jews who were se... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,863,350 | 2,863,850 |
such as stealing or sexual crimes, and who were not old enough that is they were not of age yet, not old enough to be tried under the penal procedure. They were sent to care Institutions for that. I cannot state it with absolute certainty, but I assume they were people who had formerly been in reformatories, because th... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,863,800 | 2,864,300 |
correct? A.I can no longer state whether it was Mr. Hardy or the interrogator, at any rate one of the two of them gave me the figure. Q.And since you had full confidence in these gentlemen, which went even to the extent that you would have been willing to take these two gentlemen as your defense counsel, you agreed to ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,864,250 | 2,864,750 |
which was my superior and also that of the inmates, it was Himmler himself and his deputies. That we could not expect any justice from them was clear to everybody. We did not even have to talk about that. In addition, the paradoxial and unique feature of that was that Himmler in particular and his associates, who had e... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,864,700 | 2,865,200 |
inmate then disappeared. In such a manner, he was reported and innocently was accused. The terrible thing was that this system had become some sort of home remedy. Individual blocks in which the prisoners lived five hundred together, there chief officer was an. inmate who was called the block eldest or the block truste... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,865,150 | 2,865,650 |
was this penalty executed? AOn the 6August 1942. QWhen was the permission granted? AThat can be seen on the back of the page. QOn the 10th August 1942? AOn the 10th ofAugust 1942. QWhat results as a conclusion from these dates? AThat on the 6th ofAugust while on his flight he was returned to the camp and on the 6th of ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,865,600 | 2,866,100 |
interfered the matter, end that the illegal camp committee were present during the investigation. May I quote: "When Dr. Hoven became physician and thus came under the influence of Walter Kraemer, Karl Peix - the underground movement - a change set in. Hoven refused his signature under influence and as the first of all... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,866,050 | 2,866,550 |
AYes, I have the document book. QPage 36 of the German. It is the entry of the 17th of March 1942. By means of referring to the document please find out when the experiments took place and when, the illness of Ding you once exceptionally were supposed to supervise Blocks 44 and 49. AI supervised 44 and 49, yes, that is... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,866,500 | 2,867,000 |
private nature he also secured for the hospital all kinds of advantages and prevented disturbing interruptions. Due to that - and this is a personal achievement of Hoven's -- the camp remained free of pests and with in the scope of what is humanly possible everything was done for the sick people that was possible at al... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,866,950 | 2,867,450 |
correct. Q.And is it furthermore correct that with the last - the ninety you had nothing to do? A.No, I only found out about the killing afterwards. Q.And if the killing of these informers and traitors would have been reported by you to the SS what would have been the result? A.A very welcome action against political G... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,867,400 | 2,867,900 |
of counsel for the defendant Mrugowsky the defendant Mrugowsky may be excused from attendance before the Tribunal during the session tomorrow afternoon counsel desiring to consult with his client concerning the latter's defense. Counsel for the defendant Hoven may proceed to offer the documents. MR. HARDY:It is my unde... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,867,850 | 2,868,350 |
the right to submit further evidence. THE PRESIDENT:The right to offer further evidence is reserved to counsel for the defendant Hoven. The Tribunal will now be in recess until 0930 o'clock tomorrow morning. Official Transcript of the American Military Tribunal in the matter of the United States of America against Karl... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,868,300 | 2,868,800 |
witness Dr. Koch will be called from Madaus and Dresden-Radebeul; and, finally, the lecturer in pharmacology at the University of Wuerzburg, Dr. Jung, as general experts on the sterilization questions on a pharmacological basis. THE PRESIDENT:The Tribunal now calls the case against the defendant Pokorny. At the request... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,868,750 | 2,869,250 |
semesters, I was forced to work day and night since my parents too had lost all their property due to tho war. Therefore, I worked simultaneously, in addition to my study, at the Institute for Experimental Pathology, the chief of which was the famous Professor Biedl, who was not only my chief but also a fatherly friend... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,869,200 | 2,869,700 |
Urological X-ray station, Professor Pallogey, and in the Dermatological, Richl and Arz. Later, there were short sojourns at other universities for certain specialized studies which are not very important. Q.After finishing your medical study, did you want to remain at the University or did you want to establish your ow... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,869,650 | 2,870,150 |
the discovery of this sodium chloride retention the first effective method against this terrible disease was created. In addition I also gave lectures at International Congresses, but that isn't so important. Q.What organizations of physicians or otherwise did you belong to during your student time or later on? A.I bel... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,870,100 | 2,870,600 |
I became a First Lieutenant in the Medical Corps for the second time because my promotion in Austria was not recognized by the Czechoslovakians. QAfter the occupancy of Czechoslovakia were you also drafted into the German Army? AIn 1939 all former officers of the reserve corps had to re port, and I was first informed t... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,870,550 | 2,871,050 |
soldiers at that time; as many as possible were to be classified fit for service. I did not obey this order, so far as I was able to avoid doing so, since the health of the person was more important to me than this order. In spite of the large amount of work I had to do I voluntarily conducted a dispensary for prisoner... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,871,000 | 2,871,500 |
Lotte; and a son who v/as born in 1929; his name is Thomas. QDid you have any children in your second marriage? ANo. QWitness, where are the children from your first marriage? AThey are in England. QWhen did these children go to England? AThey went in June of 1939, when they were ten and thirteen years old, respectivel... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,871,450 | 2,871,950 |
no longer there. The Czechs had emigrated to the part that still remained to Czecho-Slovakia and they had composed a large part of my practice because I was the only physician that spoke Czech and had a positive attitude toward Czecho-Slovakia. The young people after the Anschluss were called into the new formations, t... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,871,900 | 2,872,400 |
children and above all from sending them money. A lady in the employ of the Post Office informed me that of course my mail and my telephone was being checked and this could also be noticed in the letters I received. In the house, in which I had my practice, on the first floor there was a beautiful apartment, in which I... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,872,350 | 2,872,850 |
of divers ways; thus I started a book, in which I registered the expenses of the half of the house, which belonged to my wife. There I listed amounts of money which my wife did not owe to me, but by means of this book I could show the agent that my wife had debts to me and in this way I proceeded slowly in my way to pr... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,872,800 | 2,873,300 |
probably guided the people who were against me, as well as the party, the Gestapo, and the SD, and turned their attention away from me. In the meantime I had learned how one has to behave, how one has to camouflage oneself and when one can talk and when one has to be quiet. In this way I had a seeming rest finally. Q.W... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,873,250 | 2,873,750 |
see what insignia he had. He told me that the telephone conversation with my wife had been overheard and that if I should help my wife or go to Prague the next day, I would be shot in my office. Thereupon I had to send a telegram to my former wife with the words, "Our meeting tomorrow impossible", and I signed it with ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,873,700 | 2,874,200 |
from my Document Book 1. I should like to point out that by mistake an exhibit number is entered in the document books. These numbers will not be correct. The first document Pokerny No. 1 - I shall offer the affidavit of the sister of the defendant, Olga Hensel. It is on page 1. This will be Exhibit No. 1. I should lik... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,874,150 | 2,874,650 |
separated us, as we understand each other very well to this day owing to our joint pleasant experiences in the home of our parents. "I frequently visited my mother, who lived with my brother in Komotau and in this way maintained the personal contact with my brother and his wife, who lived in another apartment in Komota... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,874,600 | 2,875,100 |
outward distinction." Then I offer an affidavit by Antonie Mueller which is on page 10. This will be Exhibit No. 4. I received this affidavit unsolicited as indicated by the introduction. It says: "Through radio and newspaper reports it has come to my knowledge that one of the physicians indicted before the Allied Mili... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,875,050 | 2,875,550 |
men and as physician. Our relations became friendly and intimate from the day when Dr. Pokorny learned from me that I, too, did not belong to the NSDAP and the former Sudeten German party of Henlein. During subsequent numerous political discussions Dr. Pokorny expressed to me frankly his democratic convictions and did ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,875,500 | 2,876,000 |
addition to members of our Wehrmacht we treated voluntarily and for humanitarian reasons about 150 prisoners of war, who came to us from the prisoners' hospital about one-half hour away." The next document is an affidavit by Konrad Ritschel, on page 23, which will be exhibit 11. I should like to read one paragraph: "Du... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,875,950 | 2,876,450 |
the war, and especially an opponent of the then existing government. As an example, I mention that he expressly forbade the Hitler salute and the use of military titles. I had the impression that the whole hospital staff had been influenced by him in this sense. Dr. Pokorny had two radio sets in his private room in whi... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,876,400 | 2,876,900 |
person had the sum of 100,000 Korun and was a rich man how he suddenly had only 10,000 marks. The complaints about this rate of exchange led to a change and the rate of exchange was made one to eight. Property ownership was arranged differently than it had been. Reas estate was no longer rated at its true value, but ac... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,876,850 | 2,877,350 |
I cannot remember the exact wording of our conversations, that was seven years ago and in the seven years I have experienced a great number of serious things. I am therefore forced to tell you the general impression that I gained at the time. He told me that experiments were performed to this end and the executions of ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,877,300 | 2,877,800 |
Jews and half-Jews, as well as various hatred illusions, I thought I had to interpret that these intentions were to be extended to them. QDr. Pokorny, what effect did these statements have on you; what was your frame of mind when you heard them? ABecause all orders came from above in the Third Reich and absolutely had ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,877,750 | 2,878,250 |
correspond to the facts; and so I got the idea that this impossibility of execution might be a way out. QWitness, now what did you want to do about this article in "Umschau?" AAccording to the situation in 1941-1942, the possibility of sterilization by drugs in general and with caladium in particular, as I shall show l... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,878,200 | 2,878,700 |
He said, "Send the letter to Professor Hoehn in Berlin," and he gave me the address, but I have forgotten the address in the meantime. I don't know whether that was really Professor Hoehn or not but I think so. After a few days I dictated the letter; it was sent by mail. The important thing was that I had to give Hoehn... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,878,650 | 2,879,150 |
the Tribunal and bring this down to a minimum. THE PRESIDENT:Just condense the matter as much as you can, counsel. BY DR. HOFFMAN: Q.Witness, in the first paragraph of your letter you used a number of expressions: "If it were possible to obtain a drug which after a relatively brief time night produce unnoticed steriliz... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,879,100 | 2,879,600 |
plan originated by my asking myself: how can I make the idea plausible. You ask why Madaus was not publishing any more articles. That was probably a reflection on a remark of Vogt's who was astonished that such important scientific information was published. "The enemy listens" was a political slogan at the time which ... | Harvard: Medical Case (Karl Brandt et al.) | 2,879,550 | 2,880,050 |
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