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This is too often true. Many people try to place this as a "higher" sin. However... A big part of the problem is that many of the homosexuals and people advocating acceptance of homosexuality in churches do not consider (active) homosexuality a sin. I don't often see the attitude of "forgive me and I will try to ...
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So when they took the time to *copy* *the* *text* correctly, that includes "obvious corruptions?" So when they took the time to *copy* *the* *text* correctly, that does not exclude "variant readings from the masoretic text" which are "of little theological import" Hey, you're the expert.
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I believe that there's a 10 year period from time of death until a person can be on a commemorative stamp. It was broken once for Lyndon Johnson (I think) but other than that it has held for awhile. Of course, we can still start now -- the Elvis stamp was petitioned for ages and things really moved once it got past ...
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Yes, there are these two senses of interpretation, and certainly our decision to accept Scripture as inspired ultimately rests on our own private opinion. However, when reading Scripture, we have to remember that the Scriptures were given by God for our instruction, and that the interpretation that matters is the one...
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I recall reading somewhere that a number of bishops spent a great deal of time debating the topic of "how many angels could fit on the tip of a needle". Does anybody have a reference to this? Thanks
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Anton LaVey's interpretation of Satanism has always puzzled me. I read his "Satanic Bible" a few years ago for a social studies project, as well as a book by Arthur Lyons called "The Cult of Devil Worship in America." The latter included a very interesting interview with the Black Pope in which he did indeed say...
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I am writing a paper on religion and how it reflects and or affects modern music. This brief questionaire is summary of the questions I would like answered. A response is requested and can be mailed to me directly at: gtd259a@prism.gatech.edu *...
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If the children are not being fed, whose fault is that? You and I have plenty of food on our tables while others starve. Why is that? God gave us this earth to manage. I don't think we're doing a very good job of it. The only consolation I have for those suffering children is that they will be received into the ki...
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I agree, with the exception that I don't preach ignoring our cultures. In Revelation 2-3, we see that in the first century church, there was one congregation in each major city. So there was one unified church. Now in each city, there were people of different cultures. Naturally, they formed something of a stew, ...
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Regarding the consequences of the original sin: Catholics believe that what Adam primarily lost by his sin, for himself and the human race, was sanctifying grace. This is basically a share in the Divine life. Take a rock and make it able to talk: what God does to a human being through sanctifying grace is similar. I...
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[text deleted] [text deleted] Thank you very much Paul. I have always been impressed by the very human-ness of Mary. That God chose a woman, like me, to bring into this world the incarnation of Himself proves to me that this God is MY God. He reaches down from His perfection to touch me. Ah, the wonder of it all :...
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So do other parts of the Bible when taken literally - i.e. the Psalms saying the Earth does not move, or the implication the Earth is flat with four corners, etc. The Bible was written to teach salvation, not history or science. What ones? Paryers for the dead or the intercession of saints? (Which are taught in 2...
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: At the risk of beginning a cascade, I'll start with a possibly cheesy : good 'ol Uhmericun: : "Our shield is freedom" Or, considering what our government has been doing for the past 50 years, perhaps this would be more appropriate: "100% Debt" --
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This morning on CNN (tues April 27), Texas Cops say Arson is suspected because of two falsh points. CNN also stated that _all_ surviors claim the fires are FBI set. Your argument are made-up, untrue and unverified at best. The day of the attack the FBI claimed to have seen two BD'ers setting the fire ou...
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Hypostasis [I've explained it here before. If you want the full document, ask me by mail --Rex] "Questions arise as we begin to think about LOGOS and what His inner consciousness was composed of. We need to clarify the two natures of Christ briefly. The divine nature, which has existed eternally, did not under...
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[....] Thanks Jon. I had forgotten about the 1912 and 1927 invasions (if I had ever learned of them. I mean I *really* forgot!) But I read the context as more recent, such as when the Sandinistas were expecting an "imminent" invasion from the U.S. which never happened. I stand corrected. Thanks. I remembered t...
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Ad hominem, sarcastic innuendo? Absolutely. Forgotten? Hardly. Bored? Not really. I try not to confuse "life on a.a." with life. I just can't overcome the urge to tease/taunt folks who bound FAQ-less onto a.a. with such a chip on their shoulder. To listen to you, one might think we belonged to some church! I ...
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The problem with this view is that the topic under discussion in this passage *is* marriages that were performed on earth. Jesus' words seem to me to indicate that He regards His response as the answer to their question about which earthly marriage would be valid after the resurrection. This being the case, the most ...
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How can you tell for sure? Three days haven't passed yet. -- Steve Bittrolff
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= In article <1993Apr21.231552.24869@organpipe.uug.arizona.edu>, = = Hmm, it seems that this is the core of Christianity then, you = have to feel guilty, and then there's this single personality = that will save you from this universal guilt feeling. = = Brian, I will tell you a secret, I don't feel guilty at all, =...
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Maybe you should dig a little further Charles. Hislop's scholarship was accepted by the Bristish Oriental Institute which, at the time, was the premere Institute for Oriental studies. As I've stated over and over, I've checked out about 25% of his references (most are now out of print or in private libraries) and t...
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This thread si starting to get really silly. Such nonsense do not belong in s.r.c and it really hurts me to read some of the posts on this issue. We chose to believe whetever we want, but we are not allowed to define our own Christianity. we see in parts. If you see something that I do not see, or vice versa, it do...
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As St. Augustine said, "I did not invent original sin, which the Catholic faith holds from ancient time; but you, who deny it, without a doubt are a follower of a new heresy." (De nuptiis, lib. 11.c.12)]
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The following was published in the May 15th Rocky Mountain News. I guess I have some REAL ethical problems with the practices at this church. I understand that Baptism is an overriding factor. I also understand that this is not an honest way to proceed. Unfortunately, this is becoming more typical of congregations ...
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That's fascinating. I take it that you're expressing skepticism at the idea that those ignorant savages could have influenced the Constitution of the people who stole their continent. You could be right, but it sounds plausible to me. Is there any reason that you dismiss it out-of-hand? Here's some more: Recen...
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Um, I think you and the Bible are the ones inside the wall. There's a really wonderful world out here. You really should peek out at it sometime. The silly things you keep saying only reinforce the fact that we *are* on opposite sides of a very high wall. I see how incredibly beautiful things are on my side, and I...
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just a point, i suppose, if open mind means believing anything can be true or we can't for sure know what is definitely true, i'm happy to not be open minded. if, however, open mindedness means being respectful and tolerant towards other beliefs, respecting the rights and intelligence and wisdom of people of other...
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.. ... It sounds like she has a problem. She has a problem opening up to her husband so she is lesbian. WHAT? In a marrige, a couple is supposed to open up to each other. Because she didn't feel comfortable opening up to her husband she gets a divorce and comes to the conclusion that she is lesbian. Before anyone ...
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Ezek 22:26 God seems to be upset with the priests who have made no difference between the holy and the profane. This brought to my mind a sermon I heard recently in which the speaker said "God's second name does not begin with a D" referring, I believe, to use of God's holy name and titles as swear words. I was also ...
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Welcome to the Peace Run You're invited to join in a Global Relay Run... and help light the Way. ---- Why the Peace Run ---- There's a new spirit in the Nineties: a spirit of oneness, a growing belief in the possibility of true g...
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This is no less logical than the assumption that if something is _not_ in the Bible, then it _must not_ be done. But I don't really think that's what he's saying anyway. See below. What about the letter to Philemon? In it Paul at least hints that a certain slave be released. Also, slavery in those times wa...
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What is the proper way to dispose of old blessed palms? I`ve have a bunch that I`ve been holding onto. In addition, my mom has been giving me her's. I used to give them to my uncle who would burn them (and leave the ashes to seep into the ground). Should I do the same? Could I just bury them? Could I add them to m...
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>By the way, news.announce.newusers has an article (can't remember which >one) that recommends reading a newsgroup for 1 month before posting. >This makes sense because you get an idea who the players are and what >the current discussions are about. >Am I the only one who followed that advice? No, I spent a ...
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How come noone mentions Eric Hoffer when talking about fanatic behavior anymore?
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I am pleased to announce that a *revised version* of _The Easy-to-Read Book of Mormon_ (former title: _Mormon's Book_) by Lynn Matthews Anderson is now available through anonymous ftp (see information below). In addition to the change in title, the revised ETR BOM has been shortened by several pages (eliminating many e...
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To the media, "religion" and "cult" have about the same relative connotations as "government" and "terrorist group".
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Some years ago -- possibly as many as five -- there was a discussion on numerology. (That's where you assign numeric values to letters and then add up the letters in words, in an effort to prove something or another. I can never make any sense of how it's supposed to work or what it's supposed to prove.) Somebody po...
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Its just variation within a thread. The variation at times has been so great that speciation has occurred. So Albert Sabin is the common ancestor of several threads, some of which have themselves speciated. On a separate topic, I subscribed to t.o. just recently. Albert Sabin existed at that time, so I have no clu...
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I don't see how this logically follows. True enough, Mary received a blessing beyond any granted in all the history of humanity by being privileged to be the mother of the Savior. It says nothing about Mary needing to be a "blessed person" _first_ in order that she might thereby be worthy to bear the Son of God....
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I've heard that in California they ask you to swear without any mention of a god. What states actually include "god" in the courtroom oath?
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"We however, shall be innocent of this sin, and will pray with earnest entreaty and supplication that the Creator of all may keep unharmed the numbers of His elect." -St. Clement, Bishop of Rome, Letter to the Corinthians, 59.2, (c. 90 AD) "Ignatius also called Theophorus, to the Church at Ephesus in Asia, which...
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Are you so ignorant that you have never heard of _Archaeopteryx_? The special creation "theory" is nothing but holes. Please show me a species poofed into existence by your god. I have never seen this.
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Jeremiah: 25:27 Therefore thou shalt say unto them, Thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel; Drink ye, and be drunken, and spue, and fall, and rise no more, because of the sword which I will send among you. 25:28 And it shall be, if they refuse to take the cup at thine hand to drink, then shalt thou say unto th...
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Wow, look at alllthe pretty puddles!!!! Jimmy crack koan, and I don't care, Jimmy crack koan and i don't care, Jimmy crack Koan and i don't care, Zen Master's gone away.....
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No, Dave, and as an anthropologist I take great umbrage with this misrepresentation. I sense that it is you that has made the jump from creation (science) to religion (see above). I have characterized science/*creation science* as rationalism/nonsense, and that it is. When people promote their religious beliefs ...
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Andy Byler writes on the Biblical basis for the dogma of the Immaculate Conception: + I will put enmity between you [the Serpent] and the woman, and + between your seed and her seed, she [can also be read he] shall + crush your head and you shall bruise her [or his] heel. + -Genesis 3.15 + He who commits sin i...
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#Recently, I've asked myself a rather interesting question: What RIGHT does #god have on our lives (always assuming there is a god, of course...!) ?? # #In his infinite wisdom, he made it perfectly clear that if we don't live #according to his rules, we will burn in hell. Well, with what RIGHT can god #make that desic...
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bobbe@vice (Robert Beauchaine;6086;59-323;LP=A;YAyG) Pontificated: I would guess that you either mean that you don't have a problem swearing aligance to a non-existant being or that you are being deliberatily dense (considering what group this is). It doesn't come "quite naturally" to nonbelievers such as myself o...
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But if He/She did you would probably consider it rape. Obviously there are many Christians who have tried and do believe. So .. ? No one asks you to swallow everything, in fact Jesus warns against it. But let me ask you a question. Do you beleive what you learn in history class, or for that matter anything in...
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I think that's an insightful comment. Especially when at the same time we have people like Bill "Projector" Conner complaining that we are posting parodies.
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: |>You might visit some congregations of Christians, who happen to be homosexuals, : |>that are spirit-filled believers, not MCC'rs; before you go lumping us all : |>together with Troy Perry. : |> : Gee, I think there are some real criminals (robbers, muderers, drug : addicts) who appear to be fun loving caring pe...
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Yes, Mary is fully human. However, that does not imply that she was just as subject to sin as we are. Catholic doctrine says that man's nature is good (Gen 1:31), but is damaged by Original Sin (Rom 5:12-16). In that case, being undamaged by Original Sin, Mary is more fully human than any of the rest of us. Y...
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Why don't you tell us, Tony? I'm sure what you THINK you know adds up to a lot more than what Casper has. Doesn't it frustrate you to consider how many intelligent, thoughtful people you have prepared for the Mormon missionaries with your rant? The more you talk, the better we look. Nothing makes the truth look b...
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-- Kevin makes a good point here, and when that theists miss all-too-often. That is, the belief in a diety is not necessarily coupled with agreement/love of that diety, so really they have yet another bit of convincing to do just beyond belief. I guess the standard argumet goes something like: well, once you believe ...
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In the hands of a defender, a .357 _is_ a miracle from God. He helps those who help themselves. Or haven't you ever heard that one before?
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Now where did I put my little red book? Or was that green? Jim
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This is a RFD on a proposal for a newsgroup which would promote a sharing on the "Johannine hours" as proposed each month by the monks of the ecumenical community of Taize (pronounced te-zay) in France. NAME OF PROPOSED NEWSGROUP: ========================== soc.religion.taize (Unmoderated) PURPOSE OF THE GROUP: ...
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Not exactly correct, but nice try. The Catholic doctrine of infallibility refers to freedom from error in teaching of the universal Church in matters of faith or MORALS. It is this teaching which is taken as doctrine.
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BR> From: wpr@atlanta.dg.com (Bill Rawlins) BR> Newsgroups: alt.atheism BR> Organization: DGSID, Atlanta, GA BR> Since you have referred to the Messiah, I assume you BR> are referring to the New Testament. Please detail BR> your complaints or e-mail if you don't want to post. BR> First-century...
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This has troubled me for a long time and needs to be dealt with. From a long article Available through an individual on this newsgroup. About scripture being against homosexuality: ------------------------------------------ When we are less homophobic we will see that what we know as gay and lesbian people, engagin...
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: After reading the posts on this newsgroup for the pasts 4 months, it : has become apparent to me that this group is primarily active with : Liberals, Catholics, New Agers', and Athiests. Someone might think : to change the name to: soc.religion.any - or - perhaps even : soc.religion.new. It might seem to be ...
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Gerry Palo wrote that there is nothing in Christianity that excludes the theory of a succession of lives. I wrote that the Apostle Paul, in Romans 9, speaks of God as choosing Jacob over Esau, and adds that this is not as a result of anything that either child had done, since they had not been born yet. Clearly, Paul...
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I read an article about a poll done of students at the Ivy League schools in which it was reported that a third of the students indentified themselves as atheists. This is a lot higher than among the general population. I wonder what the reasons for this discrepancy are? Is it because they are more intelligent? Youn...
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This is the most unmitigated bilge I've seen in a while. Jim Brown obviously has possession of the right-wing token. "In December, former national security adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski told a Senate committee that sanctions were costing Iraq $100 million per day, and that the multinational coalition could take all the...
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Alan> 2. We can also analyze to whom the Lord is addressing: "Marvel Alan> not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again" (John 3:7). Alan> Here Jesus is clearly directing his remarks to Nicodemus -- a Alan> ruler of the Jews (not a child). Yes, but Jesus also made a very general and doctrinal statement in the sa...
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Perhaps you have a different understanding of what "physics" is. If we can't measure anything objectively, then the answers we get from physics aren't objective either. That's what I mean when I say there's no objective physics. Sure, we can all agree that (say) F = GMm/r^2, but that's maths. It's only physics whe...
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What is "aluminium siding"? I keep seeing references to it. Something to do with railway lines, perhaps? E-mail reply please, I'll never find it otherwise.
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I have never said that only humans are the only beings which are sufficiently sentient to have intentions. In fact, I have explicitly said that I am perfectly happy to consider that some animals *are* capable of forming intentions. What I am objecting to is considering programmed or instinctive behaviour to have mo...
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I'm sure all the religious types would get in a snit due to Asimov's atheism. Do we have any atheists on stamps now?
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I think this should be illuminating to all. Let me make a first suggestion. When Arabic words, especially technical ones, become of use let us define them for those, especially atheists, to whom they may not be terribly familiar. Please also note that though I did initially refer to Khomeini as a heretic for what ...
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There are exactly ZERO verses that "clearly" address the issues. The kind of interpretation I see as "incredibly perverse" is that applied to the story of Sodom as if it were a blanket equation of homosexual behavior and rape. Since Christians citing the Bible in such a context should be presumed to have at lea...
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[...stuff deleted...] As many posters have said in as many posts lately, this is just not true. For to show no interest in the existence of god takes no faith at all. You make the presumption that the _knowledge_ of the _possibility_ of something is enough to require faith to render that possibilty of no interest...
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Sorry, I put my foot in my mouth, concerning the church's history. It is correct to say that the Council of Hippo 393 listed the deuterocanonical books among those accepted for use in the church, and that this was ratified by the Council of Carthage, and by Pope Innoent I and Gelasius I (414 AD). "At the end of th...
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The Apocryphal books that are in the Septuagint were part of the canon used by the Greek-speaking churches from the inception of the church. They were not added later (or much later). This is a common misconception. The preference of the Hebrew canon over the Greek canon is a later innovation. The church did not ...
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Hello, Brycen ?! I'm a Norwegian journalist student - and also a Christian. Thanks for your testimony! But I want to ask you one question: What do you think of Heavy Metal music after you became a Christian? You know there are Christian bands like Barren Cross, Whitecross, Bloodgood and Stryper, that play that kind ...
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Not by any standard of history I've seen. Care to back this up, sans the lies apologists are so fond of? Not really. Most of the prophesies aren't even prophesies. They're prayers and comments taken from the Torah quite out of context. Seems Xians started lying right from the beginning. My we're an arrogant ass, a...
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Gee, since you ignored the entire substance of my substantial post, you got a lot of nerve claiming that I don't understand what's being talked about. Respond to the previous post or shut the fuck up. You're really annoying. -- Maddi Hausmann madhaus@netcom.com Centigram Communications Corp...
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[bible verses ag./ used ag. homosexuality deleted] also check out the episcopal church -- although by no means all episcopalians are sympathetic to homosexual men and women, there certainly is a fairly large percentage (in my experience) who are. i am good friends with an episcopalian minister who is ordained and l...
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Quotes from Our Daily Bread Our Daily Bread is a devotional help for spiritual growth. One can spend some ten to fifteen minutes at most reading the daily portion of scriptures and a related short article that brings the scriptures alive in applying in today's society. It ends with a saying at the bottom. This article...
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First and foremost, I honestly do not believe that Jesus was anything more than a man who lived and died two thousand years ago. I know your Bible provides wonderful stories of the things he said and did, but I simply do not believe that he still exists as an entity that has any bearing on this universe or the lives ...
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[...deletions...] An "Islamic Bank" is something which operates in a different fashion to your modern bank, as I have explained here (on another thread) before. For example, Islamic banks don't pay fixed interests on deposits, but a return on investments (which varies according to the market, and is not fixed like i...
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The dogma of the Assumption does not state whether or not Mary died a physical death before being taken into Heaven. Catholics are free to believe what they wish, whether it be that she was taken still alive, or after having died. I lean somewhat toward the latter myself.
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I looked back at this, and asked some questions of various people and got the following information which I had claimed and you pooh-poohed. The US has not sold Iraq any arms. Their navy is entirely made of F-USSR vessels. Their airforce (not including stuff captured from Kuwait which I am not as sure about), doesn'...
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I think that _The_Transcedental_Temptation_, by Paul Kurtz, has a good section on the origins of Mormonism you might want to look at.
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Faith and intelligence tell me that when a druggie breaks into my house at night with a knife to kill me for the $2 in my wallet, a .357 is considerably more persuasive than having devotions with him.
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Personal attacks? Deliberate misinterpretation of a persons statement? (By cutting out the part of the statement, he tries to blunt the thrust of the sentence. He never addresses the issue of extreemist peace people not holding true to their ideals.) Ignoring the challenge? (He ignores the challenge that extre...
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(Peter > > Simple logic arguments are folly. If you read the Bible you will see I can't. It seems Jesus used logic to make people using logic look like fools? No, that does not sound right, he maybe just told they were fools, and that's it, and people believed that... Hmm, does not sound reasonable either... I find ...
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Good point. If you haven't read "The True Believer" by Eric Hoffer, do so at your first opportunity. I don't know why Hoffer is out of style now, but "The True Believer" is still the best explanation of nutball behavior ever written.
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No. Zeno's paradox is resolved by showing that integration or an infinite series of decreasing terms can sum to a finite result. Well, suppose a probe emitting radiation at a constant frequency was sent towards a black hole. As it got closer to the event horizon, the red shift would keep increasing. The period w...
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After insult, Gregg resorts to lies:
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Ah! Excellent. So why doesn't she appear to me? I'm a little weak in the blind faith department. (Besides, she doesn't even really need to appear: how about, oh say, a little tip - something like "put your all on #3 in the 7:30 at the Dog Races" ... perhaps in a dream or vision.) I'm afraid I don't know arabic; I ha...
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Can anyone provide me a ftp site where I can obtain a online version of the Book of Mormon. Please email the internet address if possible.
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I don't necessarily disagree with your assertion, but I disagree with your reasoning. (Faith = Bad. Dogma = Bad. Religion -> (Faith ^ Dogma). Religion -> (Bad ^ Bad). Religion -> Bad.) Unfortunately, you never state why faith and dogma are dangerous. If you believe faith and dogma are dangerous because of wha...
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Heck, I remember reading a quote of Luther as something like: "Jews should be shot like deer." And of course much Catholic doctrine for centuries was extremely anti-Semitic.
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Sorry, gotta disagree with you on this one Maddi (not the resemblence to Bill. The nickname). I prefer "Half" Bake'd Timmons /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ Bob Beauchaine bobbe@vice.ICO.TEK.COM They said that Queens could stay, they blew the Bronx away, and sank Manha...
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Gee, I think there are some real criminals (robbers, muderers, drug addicts) who appear to be fun loving caring people too. So what's your point? Is it OK. just because the people are nice?
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It is important if Christianity is being damaged by it. If people who "speak in tongues" make claims that they are miraculously speaking a foreign language through the power of the Holy Spirit, when it can easily be shown that they are simply making noises, it damages all Christians, since many who are not Christians d...
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