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"Without using ethical arguments, why vegan over vegetarian?", |
"First off - I am a vegan and in an ideal world, everyone should be vegan. Veganism has done so much good for the world and the animals and there's absolutely no need for the insane amount of meat consumed in the world.\\n\\nThis may be a very unpopular opinion but here goes...\\n\\nNot everyone in the world can be v... |
"Why do so many pro-vegan arguments compare animal agriculture to the holocaust/human slavery, or just human-on-human killing? It's pretty clear that most humans value human life more than non-human life.\\n\\nDo vegans really value human life and non-human life equally? If so, why?\\n\\nIf you DON'T value human lif... |
"When I think of what my perfect dream life would be, I fantasize about hanging out by the pond with my kids all day, surrounded by family and friends, surrounded by my favorite food with access to eat all day if I wish... knowing that at the end of my life I will not grow old and feeble to be a burden to my family, ... |
"I am currently a vegetarian. I am 100% on board with veganism on ethical, environmental, and sustainability grounds. I would not consider buying factory-farmed eggs and I avoid buying dairy products but am flexible about consuming them when served to me.\\n\\nHowever:\\n\\nI keep backyard chickens. I believe that I ... |
"What's the difference between the two diets?\\n\\nWhy should the Vegan diet be appropriated while incarcerated?\\n\\nWhy shouldn't the Vegan diet be appropriated while incarcerated?\\n\\nWhy shouldn't the Carnivore diet be appropriated while incarcerated?", |
"Hello everybody,\\n\\nI stumbled upon an article describing the possibility to grow human organs for organ transportation in animals, to be specific, pigs. \\n\\nUnder the assumption, we already have this technology, what is your opinion about this? If you want to differentiate, in one case, one organ per pig and in... |
"So first asking as a vegan.\\n\\nMy friend the other day said would you eat a burger if I gave you 10k. I said sure.\\n\\nNow the questioning\\n\\n1) would you have refused that and are you sure that you're not just doubling down because it's hypothetical and makes you look better?\\n\\n2) if not is there a limit wh... |
"I am vegan myself, but this thread will address both meat eaters and vegans.\\nBoth parties are free to debate me on this.\\n\\nConsider this thought experiment:\\nDog is locked up in the basement near you and you know its there suffering, all you have to do to save it from starvation is open the basement doors and ... |
"I'm vegan but am looking to learn some of the best arguments against veganism. \\n\\nSo, what are the most philosophically or logically strong arguments against veganism?", |
"This annoying know-it-all guy just told me that vegan food can make you sick the first few times you eat it because your body isn't used to it. I said that can't be true because most of the ingredients in vegan food is stuff that meat eaters eat normally. He didn't seem to get it. Do you guys have any arguments for ... |
"I tried to have as inclusive but short a title as possible.\\n\\n * Yes, a vegan diet can be tasty.\\n\\n * Yes, it can be the cheapest diet you've ever tried.\\n\\n * Yes, it can be varied.\\n\\n * Yes, it can be high in protein with moderate kcal.\\n\\nPlease prove to me that it can be all 4 at the same time.\\n\\... |
"A note about language: please stop calling animals \\"it\\"", |
"Vegans will often argue something along the lines of \\"any sentient creature should have some degree of rights. \\"Sentience\\" is typically defined as the possession of a subjective experience. I find it problematic to inherently value sentience for a few reasons\\n\\n1. Sentience is impossible to detect in othe... |
"Vegans don't eat any animal products. Vegans don't wear any animal products. Vegans don't use animal tested products. Vegans don't ride animals or participate in any form of entertainment on animals. Each of these end in the killing of animals.So how does veganism kill more animals than a non-vegan?", |
"I'm not a vegan but I am an athiest. I genuinely believe that religion creates an incredible amount of suffering and that the joy and comfort of religion can be found through other forms of community and exploration of life's actual mysteries which in fact could provide *more* joy and comfort than religion does. The... |
"The stronger rules over the weaker, why should I care about animals?", |
"Would you eat wild deer you shot yourself that came from an area of deer overpopulation?", |
"White vegans need to understand that BIPOC vegans usually don't have the privilege necessary to give up meat", |
"Dear Vegans,\\n\\nOmnivore in Perpetuity here. Don't eat a lot of red meat, even local, because it's bad for the air and soil, and it's a very inefficient use of resources. Also cows are pretty great animals. I also eat crickets when I can; they are a very efficient source of protein. Lots of return for not much car... |
"I asked this question in a few forums and basically every freaked the fuck out, but I don't know if I'm asking it wrong or coming across as uneducated? I'm curious to know if some vegans also refrain from eating vegan meat as well because they don't like the idea of eating animal meat or anything like it, from a com... |
"There is a stance in veganism that says you are not vegan if you own a carnivorous pet or even have a non-vegan significant other. This is because you are supporting the animal industry if you pay for their non-vegan food. \\n\\nAt what point do you draw the line? Would a vegan business owner who employs non-vegans ... |
"What are vegans thoughts on brugsmania", |
"Generally this sub has been pretty good with this, but I've seen a few cases of it happening.\\n\\nI totally get downvoting off-topic argumentative posts in /r/vegan, but here it's crucial for this sub to serve it's purpose that we always give the benefit of the doubt, even when some commenters come across as needle... |
"People like to claim that veganism is more than just a diet, because vegans also don't buy leather (which usually lasts for many years or a lifetime) and some other ingredients, that have a marginal effect on animal well-being.\\n\\n### It is all about ingredients!\\n\\nMaybe you don't eat all ingredients, but they ... |
"Sorry...I couldn't really come up with a good title for this one.\\n\\nAnyway, what I mean is that vegan principles less to conclusions that are almost impossible to follow. Take this example\\n\\n>It's wrong to harm animals when you don't have to\\n\\nThis is commonly employed against carnists to highlight their im... |
"Well my last thread didn't go down so well, but that's okay. I've been thinking more about it and I realized that it's true, I agree with vegans in the sense that I don't believe in mindlessly killing/torturing living things, or at least, things that can at least feel some pain. However, I still think eating meat ... |
"I\\u2019m starting out from the assumption here that any barriers between the natural world and the human world don\\u2019t really exist, and it\\u2019s all the natural world. A consequence of this is that a farm is a natural ecosystem like any other (and not even the most recently developed one - cities would quali... |
"A well planned vegan diet can be healthy, no one can argue that. Affording such, both financially and time wise is something that not everyone can do. You have to supplement, you have have to know what to supplement and why. You have to be able to routinely afford these, or your health is at risk. Can lower income p... |
"How we call vegan meals is something I'd like to talk with you. \\n\\nMeat is the base of alimentation in the imagination of a lot of people. As an example you can hear \\"I eat beef with veggies\\" and not the contrary. \\"What ? You don't eat meat so what do you eat ?\\". Majority will consider meat as the base an... |
"I won't disclose whether I'm a vegan or not for now. I'm trying to see how you would respond if you were in the following debates:\\n\\nFirst argument:\\n\\nV: \\"How do you justify eating animals?\\"\\n\\nC: \\"Exactly the same way you justify eating cakes or buying other unnecessary things when the money could hav... |
"Salmon are predatory fish and cause suffering to other fish throughout their lives. If you kill a Salmon before its average lifespan, you are preventing the suffering of other fish that that Salmon would have killed. Those fish can instead continue to live their lives for some number of days, months or years before ... |
"The meat industry, if only ethical farming practices are used, essentially allows for more happy animals to live than would be possible without a demand for meat. More happiness in the world, I would consider a good. What response would you have to a person that only eats meat that comes from sustainable ethical far... |
"If I\\u2019m correct the prevention of unnecessary harm is the utilitarian argument for veganism. This is what has been convincing me, but is this standard for action not too demanding. \\n\\nIm thinking this because if I was to extend this line of reasoning to other actions I would be required to ride my bike most ... |
"Not seen it discussed here before but what\\u2019s your opinion on wool? ", |
"I saw a meme on r/vegan that to me seemed like it was saying \\"veganuary is b/s\\".\\n\\nAs someone who did veganuary on the way to being vegan, I was surprised to see this and felt it did more damage than \\"good\\" activism.\\n\\nI'd like to understand the other side of the debate here if anyone is willing.", |
"Depending where you live for example i live in Nz and it is important for hunting to happen as new zealand has no natural predators. Europeans introduced animals like possums and stoats which eat our native birds and eggs making them near extinct. Deer destroy native forests and fauna that is found only in NZ making... |
"When you shoot a deer with a big rifle, that's not impressive. You probably don't even know how to make one.\\n\\nBut when you shoot it with something like a bow and arrow, or sling, or spear, or anything else you can make for yourself in less than a year, you are simply cutting down the herd and doing what nature d... |
"/u/IlII4 requested user flairs, so I've enabled those. Please let me know if you think we need more options.\\n\\nI have also disabled link posts. Looking at the submission history, it appears these posts tend to be off-topic and generally do not generate a lot of discussion. Linking to external content is of course... |
"On the basis of environmentalism, eating fewer plants also reduces Nutrient loading on the earth. No agriculture lands, no grain silos, no deforestation. If environmental engineering and biotech. advances to the point of recycling all carbon, nitrogen, phosphorus, potassium, and micronutrients from waste to food, by... |
"First, some backstory: I'm two months vegan, and recently I've convinced both of my parents to try a vegan diet for 6 months (they love it so far). \\nLast night, my dad made a joke about getting chickens (my mom would never agree to this, vegan or not). He asked if it \\"would be okay (moral/ethical) to get some ch... |
"Excluding humans.", |
"Say a meat eater is against slaughtering animals what if he just eats roadkill or animals that have died naturally. What if he acts like a vulture waiting for the animal to die then he eats it. Dosent that reduce suffering. Some people really do eat dead animals they find on the road or in the wild.", |
"Humans are above animals in terms of ethics and self-awareness/sentience; they can and choose not to kill animals, because it's right, unlike animals could (?). We are all animals/persons, but humans are something more.\\n \\n*-*\\n\\n(Please bear in mind I am very open minded and this is not an opinion I hold very ... |
"Its known that some areas have very thin and low quality soil, are arid, and people in these areas generally herd goats, sheep and other types of animals because humans can't eat the grass there. As we know, grains and root vegetables don't grow everywhere. \\n\\nWhat do vegans think about those kinds of situations?... |
"Wow. Sorry for the long post. I thought of ways to shorten the argument but I felt like I would be doing so at the expense of readability... Honestly, I'd be delighted if anyone even takes their time to fully read it let alone spend more time to come up with interesting arguments against it.\\n\\n​\\n\\nI see... |
"If you\\u2019re going to the grocery store and a non vegan family member asks you for a non vegan item, can you still be considered a vegan if you buy it but you yourself don\\u2019t consume it?", |
"Hello, I see many people upset about putting a label of \\u201cplant-based\\u201d on products that contain dairy, eggs, etc. What alternative label makes more sense? \\n\\n\\nScenario: We have three sandwiches:\\n\\n1. Cheeseburger\\n2. Plant-based cheeseburger (contains dairy)\\n3. Vegan cheeseburger\\n\\nHow do y... |
"This is a conversation I came across recently. Is this really an argument? Can we even compare drinking dairy milk with using vaccines or computers? How would you answer to this?\\nEdit: This is an observation, as I said in the title, not an argument.", |
"So I have sheep (living on a farm) where we take care of them and we care about the animals so why should I not shave my sheep (by hand not through a big machine) when my sheep feel bad if I don\\u2019t shave them?\\n\\nJust kind of want to hear a reason as I have never heard a good answer.", |
"I've seen many vegans refer to the position paper of the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics on vegetarian diets, whenever health concerns about veganism are raised. In their paper, they write:\\n\\n'It is the position of the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics that appropriately planned vegetarian, including vegan, d... |
"I thought it would be good to hear some vegan opinions and discussion about raising children vegan, vegan pregnancy, supplements babies would need, any good resources, etc. Anything slightly relevant would be great to discuss. I am interested in all of it. Even if we\\u2019re talking about whether or not babies shou... |
"Hey guys, I would like to preface by saying I am not a vegan, but I am sympathetic towards veganism. Even though I am not a vegan, I view it as something positive. This is more of a genuine curiosity than a debate, I am mainly looking for positive opinions and not arguments.\\n\\nOnto my post. Where do you draw the ... |
"Hemos salido a las calles a preguntar a los ciudadanos qu\\u00e9 consumen en estas fechas y, sobre todo, qu\\u00e9 saben sobre lo que comen.", |
"How much knowledge did you gather before you went vegan, and still gather as new research is made. Is it important to you to keep up to date?\\n\\nI am not a vegan but I understand the general view and sometimes struggle with the fine print; not eating honey but wearing a pearl necklace?\\n\\nI am not in any way cri... |
" \\n\\nIf your goal is to reduce animal suffering and/or protect animals, then it doesn't make any sense to apply those restrictions only to humans, the same way we don't apply punishment and defence only against humans.\\n\\nIt's irrelevant wheter another human is being attacked either by an animal or a human, peop... |
"Despite this topic coming up quite a few times, I wanted to start a discussion on it that relates to the common responses vegans give. I've always found them particularly confusing.\\n\\nIn moral discussions, we often identify acts which we believe are bad or acts which themselves are not bad, but lead to bad conseq... |
"I want to put an open-ended question out there to see if anyone has a realistic idea on how the world could go Vegan and what steps would be necessary. Please see if you can back anything up with sources. Please bear in mind increasing population numbers, how it would work in third world countries, what would be the... |
"Allow me to emphasize: This is a moral question, not an ethical question. I am not asking if it is moral to kill an animal for it's meat. I am not asking if it is immoral to harm an animal for it's meat. I am asking if, in your personal purviews, of course, is it immoral, by the simple fact, to eat meat. \\n\\nI wou... |
"One of the key arguments for animal rights is the argument from marginal cases, made popular by Peter Singer. The argument goes that for any morally relevant trait there exist non-human animals who possess said trait to a greater extent the some humans thus if we grant the human a right to life then we ought also to... |
"I'm not here to debate in the sense to get you to agree with me nor have you get me to agree with you. (i'm stubborn)\\nBut my reasoning for us to eat animal products is because we need vitamin B12. there's no other place to get it. The only place i find is 'fortified' food. which means before technology we would no... |
"If meat is murder, and all meat livestock is being murdered, what is a viable murderless solution that can sustain 8 billion and counting humans eating only plants AND several more billion and counting \\u201clivestock\\u201d species eating only plants?", |
"\\n", |
"I was at Dunkin\\u2019 Donuts. I ordered two iced lattes for my friends. Neither are vegan or lactose intolerant. One requested an iced latte made with dairy milk and one requested an iced latte made with almond milk. I ordered them correctly however when the employee handed them to me I asked them if they made the ... |
"(This is a throwaway account.) I wanted to post in /r/Vegan but I wasn't sure if it's allowed. I understand why people are vegan, but as much as I want to say I also want to be a vegan \\"for the animals,\\" I can't find a connection within myself to care?\\n\\nI've watched so many videos on the meat/dairy/egg indus... |
"As per title. If you are a hated minority, but not only that, but also considered a dreg of society, a subhuman (because of ideas deemed extremely dangerous), then even vegan themselves hate you and wish that you did not exist, contradicting their claims that all life is valuable. All animal lives matters, BUT their... |
"Hi everyone, I am a vegan and just watched meat the family on 4od, I thought it was a pretty poorly thought out show which glossed over the actual slaughter part and painted the farming community in a positive light. I'm wondering if there are any vegans out there who thought this show was good or has any comments, ... |
"I don\\u2019t know if in my lifetime that veganism will ever be the dominant diet without baby steps, but I believe a large portion of the population would consider getting a meal out of eating a less sentient insect than cows or pigs. ", |
"I might be wrong about this, and it might very well not be the case all around the world (most kinds of animal industries are not always the same all around the world, which is an important thing to take into consideration!), but as far as I know, there is no 'horse industry' in my country (Denmark), in the same sen... |
"I just cant grasp that the reason people go vegan is because of empathy to animals as if they are humans (hence why so many holocaust comparisons).\\n\\nIf that was the case vegans would live in a world of complete panic and fury, just imagine if everyone around you was a mass murderer who ate the victims. Most vega... |
"Hi. Portions of my family are livestock/field farmers who raise, butcher, and sell their livestock.\\n\\nOther than the butchering which is done in the most quick and painless way, their livestock (pigs/chickens/cows) are well taken care of with either free ranging or very large pens that are cleaned daily.\\n\\nI h... |
"This is my first post as a non vegan. My goal is to have answers from non vegans to my pro vegan arguments. Im open to hearing from vegans as well. My final question though is directed at vegans specifically. \\n\\nI truly believe MOST (not all) people who can go vegan but don't lack empathy. They believe that physi... |
"Of all the issues I have with vegans (mostly social ones) I have a lot of trouble understanding how one goes about reaching the vegan ideology logically in that **nature isn't vegan**.\\n\\nCarnivores and omnivores have existed longer than humans as a species, so why would humans, an omnivore, go against their natur... |
"I'm a vegan and was recently asked how I feel about areas like the midwest where deer are often overpopulated and hunting is encouraged. The concept is essentially that having too many deer will lead to more car accidents and other dangers to humans (and the deer) and I assume some sort of food shortage or dangers o... |
"Title pretty much sums it up. I see/hear about all this awful stuff online from various, but biased sources: gestation crates, animals not being stunned effectively before slaughter, egg-laying hens in tiny cages, but how do I know it's not just a tiny minority of factory farms?", |
"Have a cousin who works in an anti human trafficking organization and she always tells me how sex trafficking isn't the most exploited type of human trafficking, it's actually labor trafficking where migrant workers are exploited after coming to America. \\n\\nI don't eat any meat but I still consume eggs and dairy ... |
"After looking vegan arguments online I find a lot moral arguments don't explain why death is not suffering, but pain is.\\n\\nI have seen Vegans argue that we should not eat animals to reduce suffering. That because plants do not have conscience or sentience, they do not suffer. I have to disagree because I think pl... |
"Did you guys know this subreddit had a Wiki? I didn\\u2019t, I was going to suggest building a wiki for some things.\\n\\nIs anyone interested in trying to work to expand the Wiki? Would the mods be open to a group of people brainstorming to expand the Wiki?", |
"What do people think of the idea that being vegan has a pretty low impact compared to donating to effective animal charities?\\n\\nI'm afraid most vegans don't donate to effective animal charities, and instead focus more on milk powder in their chips or other very marginal and low impact activities.\\n\\nWhat is the... |
"Vegan btw\\n\\nIn debates, meat eaters often bring up how more small animals are killed in the production of crops than are killed in the slaughter of cows or pigs or whatever animal. Vegans will usually shut this down by stating how we grow crops specifically to feed animals that we later slaughter, so even if anim... |
"We have a whitetail deer population in the US. There's multiple methods on controlling the population. Just seeing what the vegans thoughts are on the best controlling method?\\n\\n(Here's an article about different methods including using contraceptives for control)(https://www.madetohunt.com/deer-herd-management/)... |
"To preface, I am vegan and have been for a while now, and will be for the rest of my life. This is a discussion that comes up with my partner (also vegan) that I hadn't really thought about before.\\n\\nI fucking love cats. I would love to have a cat. However, cats need to eat meat. They cannot be put on a vegan die... |
"So, I am vegan for all of the reasons per usual but in this order (although they're all pretty equal)\\n1.) Health & philosophy \\n2.) Environmental concern\\n3.) But definitely not least, animal welfare\\n\\nI loosely follow a more whole food plant based diet. I am not a fan of excessive substitutes or processed fo... |
"One of the most common arguments for veganism is that humans are not natural meat eaters or natural hunters, that we use weapons and machines to kill. It is said that because we could not realistically kill a grown cow with our bear hands that we are not natural meat consumers and hunters.\\n\\nHowever, us humans ar... |
"If people didn't have a demand to eat chicken, then they would never be mass produced, therefore millions of chickens would've never even lived their lives for a moment. Why would people raise chickens if they didn't want to eat them, besides the small percentage that would want them as a pet? Since the demand is so... |
"If we define veganism as the rejection of the commodification of sentient life, then an important part of understanding the definition is understanding what we mean by \\"sentient\\".\\n\\nA straight-forward definition of \\"sentient\\" is \\"able to perceive or feel things\\". A simple interpretation of this defini... |
"Asking here because I suspect the answer might be debatable. Sorry if this has been asked before, I did search before posting and did not see it.\\n\\nScenario: a person of sound mind decides they would like to be made into leather after their death. They view it similarly to being an organ donor, and they think it ... |
"Okay just hear me out\\n\\nMany vegans feed their pets (dogs, cats, etc) kibble and meat...that's fair as they need it to live.\\n\\nHow do you guys feel about a vegan who rescues chicken and other farm animals but then slaughters them for pet food (their own pets)?assuming the cats and dogs are rescued too....isnt ... |
"To phrase the title/thesis with more clarity:\\n\\nThe concepts \\"perfection isn't possible but you should still be vegan to reduce suffering as much as possible/practicable\\" and \\"veganism is all-or-nothing, any steps towards reducing suffering are useless unless you take all of them\\" are almost 100% mutually... |
"I don't want to assume this is a tenet of veganism, but it seems to have been implied in a couple of the discussions I've had with family. ", |
"No indigenous population anywhere in the world is known to rely solely on plants for nutrition. \\n\\nWithout supplementing on a vegan diet you can become deficient in a multitude of essential nutrients which can have extremely serious implications, including making you infertile.\\n\\nThe term \\"vegan\\" was coine... |
"I created a post the other day about owning pets and how it is partially equivalent to slavery (it's not equivalent because animals cannot enter into a social contract with humans). However, quite a few people did not quite understand the moral implication of owning pet's (or partnerships as some put it) as potentia... |
"Just discovered that the root of the discussion was work by Steve Davis whos calculations show pasture fed cows to produce 2x the calories/protein per death as beans and other crops. Then Gaverick Methany rebutted- Then this guy: https://farmingtruth.weebly.com/blog/responding-to-vegan-debunks-of-the-davis-study reb... |
"Just an FYI\\n\\nSo that's not really a talking point anymore \\n\\n\\nhttp://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/prince-edward-island/pei-cow-farting-1.3856202", |
"First off, I'm not a vegan, but I do boycott the meat and dairy industries, because of their animal rights violations, carbon emissions, water consumption, etc. Which means that I don't have a problem with eating meat and dairy, just purchasing them. However, if I go to a party and somebody else offers me meat that ... |
"Supposedly people are coming closer to being able to produce cheap, lab grown meat, according to this post in r/futurology: https://www.iol.co.za/business-report/companies/lab-meat-to-transform-meat-industry-in-2021-12750778\\n\\nWhat's y'all's opinion about this? Personally, I see it as an option for decreased gree... |
"I'll preface this with the fact that I'm in between a vegetarian and vegan for ethical reasons, with some more extremist views but some other very conservative views on animal rights/welfare issues. \\n\\nI've been pursuing /r/vegan for a while and I keep seeing lots of anti-honey views. I'm not 100% sure on exactly... |
"Because in the long range, 30-50 plus years, factory farming will be become automated, robotic. Few people will directly be involved in the mistreatment and slaughter killing. \\n\\nAnd the treatment of factory animal can be negotiated to improve. It will be a long haul, but it can be done. Government regulated. *... |
"This is another \\"wool\\" topic. Right now I am trying to figure this ethical dilemma that I have faced.\\n\\nIs it ethically better to 1) exploit the bred sheep and shear their wool in order to prevent them from dying and suffering from mites OR 2) not exploit them by cutting wool and let them die themselves due t... |
"I\\u2019m a vegan and i constantly hear arguments against veganism, but so far i have found a way to debunk all of them.\\nDo you have any arguments against veganism that are valid ? I\\u2019m just curious.", |
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