77： Automations Gone Wrong _transcript.txt

[0.00 --> 4.02]  So it's a small house after all because Alex and family are back from London.
[4.16 --> 5.00]  How are you doing, Alex?
[5.48 --> 7.40]  Well, Chris, I'm tired.
[9.60 --> 10.52]  I bet.
[11.14 --> 12.96]  It's a different side of the world, Alex.
[13.24 --> 13.56]  Yeah.
[13.78 --> 14.34]  I don't know.
[14.50 --> 17.78]  This week, I just haven't been able to get back into the groove.
[18.08 --> 23.58]  I went back to work on Monday like a normal person and somehow it's Wednesday night and I'm still tired.
[24.58 --> 28.48]  Typically, I find jet lag about an hour a day and you're about right.
[28.48 --> 29.96]  And it's, you know, we flew back on Saturday.
[30.06 --> 31.74]  I should be good about now.
[32.26 --> 35.46]  I'm recalling that the night you arrived, you said, oh, going east is easy.
[36.04 --> 36.44]  West.
[36.88 --> 37.80]  I guess I screwed that up.
[39.48 --> 42.20]  I think the trouble with going east is from America, at least.
[42.50 --> 46.88]  All the flights across the Atlantic pretty much are red eye flights.
[47.08 --> 52.42]  And so you lose not only the night of good sleep, but then you also get to your destination at 7 a.m.
[52.68 --> 56.80]  And then you have to stay awake all day on top of no sleep.
[57.20 --> 58.36]  Yeah, man.
[58.48 --> 59.64]  So we're all friends here.
[59.94 --> 62.48]  Is it easier or harder having Brent there when you get back?
[63.10 --> 63.52]  Hey, now.
[63.82 --> 69.58]  Oh, it's lovely because, yeah, the fridge is stocked and, you know, loads of little things.
[69.74 --> 71.18]  The house feels like it's been lived in.
[71.76 --> 72.48]  The dog's happy.
[72.82 --> 77.80]  You know, whenever you go away, there's inevitably something you forget, like you forget to take out the rubbish or something.
[77.90 --> 79.32]  And you come back and it's a stinky bin.
[80.04 --> 80.80]  Nothing like that.
[80.92 --> 81.32]  It's all good.
[82.00 --> 82.32]  Yeah.
[82.80 --> 83.36]  That is nice.
[83.36 --> 84.92]  It's handy having a Brent around, right?
[85.16 --> 85.30]  Yeah.
[85.30 --> 86.92]  And I think Archie had a good time, too.
[87.22 --> 87.96]  Oh, he had a great time.
[88.02 --> 88.12]  Yeah.
[88.18 --> 90.40]  He took care of me more than I took care of him, I think.
[90.64 --> 91.66]  I got lots of good videos.
[92.04 --> 92.32]  Aw.
[92.80 --> 95.58]  I know you came in handy when those thunderstorms rolled around, so.
[95.82 --> 96.18]  Oh, yeah.
[96.18 --> 104.60]  Hey, now, did the pair of you see that the Excel, the World Excel Championships are currently live on ESPN2 right now?
[104.78 --> 107.48]  Is this Excel, like, spreadsheets or is this Excel, like, cars?
[107.48 --> 107.84]  Oh, yes.
[107.84 --> 108.64]  Oh, my goodness.
[109.04 --> 110.42]  Link in the chat.
[110.52 --> 111.12]  Link in Discord.
[111.36 --> 112.10]  No, no, no, no, no.
[112.10 --> 112.42]  Really?
[112.74 --> 113.88]  What do they do?
[114.10 --> 114.50]  Competitive.
[115.10 --> 116.02]  You're not kidding.
[116.42 --> 118.26]  Competitive Excel formula writing.
[118.40 --> 119.08]  I am not joking.
[119.28 --> 120.28]  This is a real sport.
[120.38 --> 121.08]  Oh, my goodness.
[121.08 --> 124.76]  This is so good.
[125.16 --> 126.78]  Oh, this is so good.
[126.92 --> 128.16]  No Python allowed?
[128.22 --> 128.68]  Is that it?
[128.94 --> 138.72]  Well, this tournament for a one-of-a-kind sport pits the best against the best as eight experts try to solve original tasks about lottery answers.
[139.22 --> 143.88]  And the goal is to answer as many questions as possible in a limited amount of time.
[143.98 --> 149.90]  We should do this, but, like, with Linux and free software projects and, like, open source projects and self-hosting trivia.
[150.20 --> 150.68]  Now you're talking.
[150.68 --> 151.44]  We could do this.
[151.66 --> 152.32]  This could be fun.
[152.44 --> 155.34]  We should definitely have a self-hosted or Linux kind of trivia night.
[155.34 --> 161.76]  I know I threatened it at the Denver meetup last year, but how about we make something happen at the JPL meetup?
[162.12 --> 162.46]  Oh.
[163.30 --> 163.70]  Oh.
[165.58 --> 170.60]  Speaking of which, just a little early plug in the show, self-hosted.show slash JPL.
[170.86 --> 176.94]  If you're in the Southern California area and you want to put your name in the hat for the JPL tour, that's where you go.
[177.38 --> 179.22]  But please make sure you can actually make it.
[179.22 --> 181.36]  Self-hosted.show slash JPL.
[181.36 --> 181.64]  JPL.
[181.64 --> 185.40]  I have been just sitting here waiting for this episode.
[185.40 --> 196.32]  I wanted to hear Brent's opinions of what it's like to live in your house after you've automated everything because you have built that entire system to fit your needs, your family's needs, right?
[196.32 --> 197.90]  You didn't build it for Brent's needs.
[197.90 --> 202.84]  And for a little while after you left, I don't think Brent had access to the dashboard or anything like that.
[202.88 --> 205.70]  So he just lived with the automations as they were.
[205.78 --> 218.28]  So I thought it'd be really fun today to get in to just find out what that's like, to live with another man's automations, another man's home assistant, and kind of get a review from a third-party perspective on your setup.
[218.28 --> 231.08]  And then also later in the show, I got a Shelly humidity and temperature sensor, and I got one of their power plugs, and I have them running right now, and I want to share my thoughts on that stuff.
[231.08 --> 236.60]  But what do you guys say we jump into Brent's impressions of living with your assistant, Alex?
[236.74 --> 237.32]  I'm nervous.
[238.02 --> 242.54]  I was actually really interested when Brent stayed with us in the RV, what his experience was like.
[242.76 --> 256.06]  But one of the things that I did, I don't think you had time for just because of circumstances, was when the first night Brent stayed with us, I gave him a little tour of the system to kind of show him how to control it where the tablets were at.
[256.06 --> 263.22]  But you guys basically had like a meet and greet in the airport, and then it was like, yeah, two planes in the night passing.
[264.60 --> 266.04]  That was not the original plan.
[266.06 --> 267.36]  How many hours delayed were you?
[267.42 --> 268.58]  Like 19 or something?
[268.80 --> 268.96]  Yeah.
[269.26 --> 269.58]  Yeah.
[269.58 --> 273.22]  I had to do an overnight and all hotel and all the whole thing.
[273.40 --> 276.20]  So anyways, we met on the security side of the airport.
[276.30 --> 276.74]  That was fun.
[276.90 --> 277.72]  I haven't done that before.
[277.72 --> 277.76]  Sure.
[278.52 --> 285.68]  But luckily, because of the Raleigh meetup that we did here, I did have some experience with the automations.
[286.44 --> 289.58]  And Chris, I know you also had some experiences here.
[289.64 --> 290.24]  We all did.
[290.24 --> 298.24]  And Alex was kind of showcasing them at the time because it was the first time any of us had seen sort of everything he set up in the new house.
[298.54 --> 300.76]  And I followed some of it with the show as well.
[300.94 --> 303.30]  You know, like Alex and I have talked about some of it on the show.
[303.30 --> 314.32]  So I kind of, when I arrived at Alex's house, I pretty much knew what to expect right away because it's something he and I kind of talk about more frequently than probably I would imagine the two of you do.
[314.82 --> 315.20]  It's true.
[315.30 --> 319.06]  I'm relatively new to home assistant, home automation stuff.
[319.28 --> 325.60]  But thanks to you, Chris, I do have nimble fingers around trying to operate some of it as an outside user.
[326.16 --> 327.34]  This is an interesting question.
[327.42 --> 330.26]  Did much of it change from last time I was here to this time?
[330.56 --> 331.50]  No, I don't think so.
[332.08 --> 332.54]  Okay, good.
[332.54 --> 333.56]  That was going to be my answer.
[334.00 --> 335.82]  So I had some patterns in mind.
[335.92 --> 341.20]  I know that Alex and Kat have certain routines that they set off.
[341.60 --> 353.52]  One of them, even when I visited them years ago in their old place, was their like goodnight routine and sort of the bedtime countdown and all the lights would sort of dim down a little bit.
[353.52 --> 355.80]  And I kind of missed that when you were gone.
[355.80 --> 358.78]  Because I, A, didn't know how to set that off.
[359.46 --> 369.08]  And B, like I didn't even know where to start looking for like random switches or physical enablements to make that happen.
[369.08 --> 370.70]  And so I just lived with that.
[371.36 --> 372.04]  So sad.
[372.04 --> 374.18]  I think I need to improve my documentation, huh?
[374.18 --> 377.02]  That's the first thing to go out of date typically.
[377.02 --> 384.34]  So I used to do the bedtime routine through a Google Home with a, hey, tube, please.
[384.84 --> 385.98]  What did I say?
[386.30 --> 387.24]  I think I just said bedtime.
[387.98 --> 388.68]  Yeah, something like that.
[388.76 --> 390.22]  That's what you used when I stayed with you.
[390.22 --> 393.70]  But now I have the IKEA Trad Free buttons.
[394.16 --> 397.80]  I have one of these next to my bed, you know, just in the bedroom.
[398.48 --> 403.38]  And when I want to shut the house down, I just press the button and it starts the, it shuts down.
[403.46 --> 404.74]  I think it turns off all the lights.
[404.86 --> 409.48]  It sets the AC to a, you know, a slightly warmer temperature overnight to save me a bit of money.
[410.10 --> 419.40]  It turns off all the outdoor lights, turns off several smart plugs as well as like the garage door openers, ensures the garage doors are shut, that kind of thing.
[419.40 --> 419.72]  Okay.
[421.26 --> 421.96]  Very nice.
[422.24 --> 424.52]  And I have something very similar at home as well.
[424.52 --> 431.90]  We have kid bedtime, which is a kind of reduced version of that that just gets everything shut down for the kids.
[432.08 --> 434.94]  And then we have what I call last call.
[435.46 --> 442.94]  And I picked a name that wasn't good night because some of the smart assistants actually have like a predefined response for good night.
[443.56 --> 443.64]  Yeah.
[443.98 --> 445.84]  So I did last call for mine.
[446.06 --> 447.96]  And that's just a script in Home Assistant.
[447.96 --> 452.20]  It does pretty much similar to what Alex said, except for the garage doors.
[452.54 --> 456.20]  I don't have those, but it does turn cameras on, shuts lights off.
[456.28 --> 457.86]  It turns on white noisemakers.
[458.16 --> 461.78]  It sets thermostats to certain temperatures and all of that kind of stuff.
[461.84 --> 463.84]  And it does like Alex does as well.
[463.92 --> 465.30]  It does a cascade shutdown.
[465.30 --> 469.30]  So things kind of selectively turn off in order.
[469.46 --> 473.00]  So it gets darker in stages over a 15 minute period.
[473.00 --> 478.48]  The other thing I have, I think at night is I think it's 2.30 a.m. or something.
[478.60 --> 479.90]  I have a hard cut off.
[480.06 --> 480.34]  It is.
[480.64 --> 481.60]  I've experienced it.
[481.82 --> 484.02]  Because I mean, you know, I've got kids now.
[484.28 --> 485.48]  A kid singular.
[485.88 --> 488.58]  I don't stay up that because she's up at six, you know.
[488.78 --> 490.86]  So 2.30 a.m.
[490.86 --> 496.06]  It hard turns off all the smart switches, all the lights, everything just as a catch-all
[496.06 --> 498.50]  in case anything didn't execute it at bedtime.
[499.34 --> 505.22]  Yeah, that tripped me up a few nights when I was, let's just say, staying on mountain
[505.22 --> 507.22]  time, despite being in Eastern time.
[507.46 --> 508.18]  Mountain time.
[508.32 --> 511.42]  From what I guess from Alex, from what you're describing, it seems to me like that would
[511.42 --> 518.54]  be a really common button or automation that would have the most actions to it.
[518.54 --> 521.30]  It sounds like, Chris, tons of stuff happens for you.
[521.40 --> 523.78]  And Alex, tons of stuff happens for you at that time of day.
[523.80 --> 527.22]  And I would assume any other time of day doesn't quite have that much stuff going on.
[527.72 --> 529.18]  It sounds like a lot.
[529.82 --> 534.26]  But really, all it's doing is turning off a couple of light groups and a couple of switch
[534.26 --> 534.64]  groups.
[535.34 --> 538.38]  Because, you know, I have everything grouped together.
[538.54 --> 543.14]  So it's really, I mean, I've added, I've given it a lot of thought about what lives in
[543.14 --> 543.60]  which group.
[543.74 --> 548.42]  But actually, in terms of the number of steps, there's a few timers and stuff in there, too.
[548.54 --> 550.24]  But I mean, it's actually quite simple.
[550.50 --> 553.18]  So the modular logic to it all makes it actually quite simple.
[553.34 --> 553.50]  Nice.
[554.26 --> 556.50]  Yeah, depending on how you add groups and whatnot.
[556.82 --> 558.80]  And I also have like some delays in there.
[559.04 --> 563.46]  So one group will go off and then like a 10 minute timer goes for some stuff.
[564.32 --> 565.82]  That's where it kind of gets a little weird.
[565.94 --> 566.86]  But that's just preference.
[566.86 --> 572.98]  You know, what I did learn last night, however, is that Alex alluded that he and his wife,
[573.06 --> 576.98]  Catherine, each have a button and they accomplish slightly different tasks.
[577.52 --> 579.04]  Do you want to, did you describe that?
[579.08 --> 580.36]  Do you want to make sure that's clear?
[580.76 --> 581.02]  Do we?
[581.30 --> 581.66]  Oh, yeah.
[581.76 --> 582.32]  I thought you did.
[582.56 --> 583.20]  There was like a...
[583.20 --> 583.40]  I think we do.
[583.74 --> 584.78]  Oh, sorry.
[585.90 --> 586.96]  I was sure you did.
[587.40 --> 589.66]  You have like a soft good night and then a...
[589.66 --> 589.88]  No?
[590.06 --> 590.38]  All right.
[590.46 --> 590.70]  All right.
[590.70 --> 593.92]  We tried that and it was just chaos.
[595.54 --> 597.16]  Because what happens if I go to bed first?
[597.90 --> 601.08]  Well, I was going to say, that's what happened when we started watching RuPaul's Drag Race.
[601.46 --> 605.70]  You see, so all that happens is I just push the bedtime button without thinking.
[605.86 --> 608.00]  And because it's habit, I go to bed, I push that button.
[608.60 --> 615.02]  So what I really need is a soft, you know, just turn on my bedside light, you know, button
[615.02 --> 616.60]  and leave the rest of the house alone button.
[616.60 --> 622.32]  I think that really brings me to a nice segue, which is that having a Brent in your home
[622.32 --> 625.12]  is a good way to find like little bugs in your automations.
[625.54 --> 627.48]  Like that's a simple one, but it's something.
[627.48 --> 632.60]  Here I am in England enjoying my sister's wedding and I got a text from Brent saying,
[632.92 --> 634.44]  your kitchen lights aren't turning on, bro.
[634.70 --> 638.24]  Well, the other thing that's going to happen that'll force you to adjust this is you're
[638.24 --> 641.48]  going to have to create like a kid bedtime automations like I have, right?
[641.48 --> 646.94]  I have a partial kind of a soft bedtime for the kids, which for me, right, that's just
[646.94 --> 651.16]  shutting down the first half of the RV, but leaving the back half of the RV still online.
[651.24 --> 653.64]  But for you, it's going to be a lot more complicated.
[654.20 --> 657.58]  I think as well that this speaks to a good point about home automation in general.
[658.22 --> 665.34]  Lately, I've really struggled to find it interesting because there are so many edge cases that you
[665.34 --> 669.84]  have to consider and the entropy of stuff just breaking.
[669.98 --> 673.78]  A good example of these Bluetooth low energy temperature sensors that I have, the Xiaomi,
[674.12 --> 676.14]  I forget the name of them.
[677.04 --> 678.30]  They're made by Xiaomi anyway.
[678.68 --> 678.76]  Yeah.
[679.24 --> 680.50]  They just drop off the network.
[680.76 --> 684.94]  They just drop off Bluetooth, even though the ESP32 is still online because I can ping
[684.94 --> 686.32]  the damn thing and I can log into it.
[686.42 --> 686.90]  It's still there.
[687.30 --> 688.06]  Stuff just breaks.
[688.16 --> 690.24]  It just doesn't quite work 100% reliably.
[690.42 --> 692.92]  And I don't know, I'm getting a bit fatigued with it.
[692.92 --> 696.82]  No, I understand too, because when a temperature sensor breaks, a bunch of other crap breaks
[696.82 --> 697.88]  and that's really annoying.
[698.16 --> 699.76]  So it's a bit of a domino effect then.
[699.94 --> 702.48]  I will say I'm going to get to this one and we get to the Shelley stuff.
[702.92 --> 707.04]  Wi-Fi, Z-Waiver, Zigbee only for me from now on because of this very reason.
[707.60 --> 711.60]  And nothing battery powered when it comes to sensors where I want a lot of data from.
[712.26 --> 715.80]  You know, just to kind of circle back to the original idea I had here for just kind of
[715.80 --> 717.14]  picking Brent's brain on this.
[717.46 --> 719.32]  I'm curious what you thought worked well, Brent.
[719.32 --> 722.82]  We kind of got an idea of what maybe didn't work, but I'm curious what you were
[722.82 --> 725.74]  impressed by or you thought was nice while you were staying there.
[726.12 --> 730.28]  You know, it's actually a difficult question to answer because the things that work nicely,
[730.42 --> 731.50]  you just sort of forget.
[732.54 --> 736.66]  If you're not noticing, it means that it's working, which is kind of fascinating.
[736.86 --> 741.80]  Speaking of the kitchen lights then, so I have an automation based on a, I think it's
[741.80 --> 745.32]  a Hue Zigbee motion sensor that talks to my Conbee 2.
[745.32 --> 748.26]  It's attached to the lights.
[748.38 --> 754.42]  It's got a magnetic back to it and it's angled such that it picks up both, actually all three
[754.42 --> 755.50]  entry points to my kitchen.
[756.20 --> 761.92]  If you're sat at the dinner table for more than about 10 minutes still, which with a
[761.92 --> 765.18]  toddler does not happen, the lights will turn off.
[765.34 --> 768.42]  And so my timeout was, you know, I think it was seven minutes, actually, not 10.
[769.36 --> 773.04]  So the first few days I get a message from Brent saying, your kitchen lights keep turning
[773.04 --> 775.90]  off on me or the motion sensor isn't picking me up properly.
[776.66 --> 781.32]  Yeah, here I am having a nice peaceful dinner, me and my wonderfully cooked meal and the lights
[781.32 --> 782.74]  keep turning off on me.
[782.94 --> 788.42]  So I adjusted the timeout to 25 minutes, just thinking that was the longest possible time
[788.42 --> 789.78]  a human could spend eating dinner.
[790.46 --> 792.58]  No, no, Brent, how did that work out for you in the end?
[792.76 --> 793.36]  I'm curious.
[793.36 --> 798.22]  You know, for like a sit down at the table dinner, which for you is over pretty quickly,
[798.34 --> 800.70]  but for me was obviously the need for the change.
[800.82 --> 801.66]  That was totally great.
[801.94 --> 806.70]  Where it changed was I've discovered that really cozy chair that you have in the kitchen.
[806.84 --> 807.90]  It's like a lounge chair.
[808.06 --> 810.36]  Yeah, one of those Ikea chairs.
[811.12 --> 814.50]  So Archie and I would often like curl up there during thunderstorms.
[814.60 --> 818.20]  And so, but the lights would go out and actually that was a feature, I think.
[818.26 --> 819.88]  So I didn't ask you to change it, right?
[819.88 --> 823.02]  Brent can be a still man for a prolonged period of time.
[823.36 --> 826.54]  But isn't this, this is exactly what I was talking about, you guys.
[826.62 --> 830.28]  Like you build something for yourself and then somebody comes along who just doesn't
[830.28 --> 833.44]  live the way you live and they find the edge cases.
[833.52 --> 834.96]  And I just find that just fascinating.
[835.14 --> 836.18]  Yeah, it's a difference in behavior.
[836.70 --> 841.72]  And Alex was kind enough to hand me a login to the interface to make some changes.
[841.86 --> 846.88]  But I was too scared to change things in there because I feel like if he's that way about
[846.88 --> 849.46]  his desk chair, who knows how he is about his home assistant.
[849.46 --> 851.64]  He's got backups of his config.
[851.64 --> 853.52]  He doesn't have backups of the physical chair.
[853.62 --> 855.36]  He wants me to test the backups, does he?
[855.82 --> 856.22]  I do.
[858.08 --> 860.60]  What do they call that in enterprise?
[860.76 --> 861.66]  Disaster recovery?
[863.38 --> 864.46]  You are the disaster.
[864.80 --> 865.92]  Oh, thank you.
[865.96 --> 866.72]  I need a t-shirt.
[868.10 --> 872.18]  But Chris, to answer your original question, I would say a lot of the lights worked really
[872.18 --> 872.44]  well.
[872.92 --> 876.34]  Alex, as you know, has a bunch of mood lights in this particular room where we are, which
[876.34 --> 880.24]  is kind of, you call it your bonus room, but it's kind of the lounge or the tinkering.
[880.24 --> 882.56]  You know, your desk is there where you do a lot of your tinkering.
[882.82 --> 883.62]  That's where we are right now.
[884.20 --> 890.50]  And it's kind of this mood lighting that is just I never thought of, except at 2.30 in
[890.50 --> 891.46]  the morning when it all turned off.
[891.58 --> 894.94]  But other than that, which was most of the time, it was just perfect.
[895.06 --> 896.16]  And I didn't have to think about it.
[896.22 --> 897.92]  And it was just right for the time of day.
[898.06 --> 901.06]  I thought that was really great and really added to the room.
[901.06 --> 906.30]  I'm quite proud of the lighting in this room in particular, because it's based off of the
[906.30 --> 911.34]  elevation of the sun rather than time of day or anything like that.
[911.42 --> 917.24]  So as the sun's elevation in the sky changes throughout the year, so does the, I guess,
[917.28 --> 919.28]  the light turn on off time?
[919.44 --> 919.56]  Yeah.
[919.62 --> 919.86]  Okay.
[919.90 --> 920.60]  That's great.
[921.40 --> 922.30]  That's really neat.
[922.38 --> 923.26]  What gave you that idea?
[924.28 --> 925.58]  I think just a forum post.
[925.78 --> 927.24]  I wish I could take credit.
[927.24 --> 929.74]  I love that you can even do that, really.
[929.86 --> 930.44]  Let's be honest.
[930.58 --> 930.68]  Yeah.
[930.80 --> 936.24]  One thing I'd like to do, and if any listeners have an idea, I've got a skylight behind me
[936.24 --> 940.54]  here, and it's got a proprietary Velux shade on it.
[940.80 --> 946.26]  And I leave it open about two or three inches, because during the day, the sun blasts through
[946.26 --> 947.76]  that because it's a south-facing roof.
[948.30 --> 950.70]  And it would just discolor my drums and get them hot.
[950.94 --> 952.60]  And, you know, instruments are quite sensitive.
[953.20 --> 957.20]  So what I'd love is during the day, whilst the sun is beating down, for that thing to
[957.20 --> 960.36]  be, you know, in its daytime position almost all the way down.
[960.86 --> 965.64]  And then, of an evening, open it right up once the sun's done doing its thing for the
[965.64 --> 965.84]  day.
[966.36 --> 969.64]  I'm tempted to take apart the remote that I have, the Velux remote.
[969.84 --> 971.68]  It's some kind of wireless thing.
[971.72 --> 974.64]  I don't know what protocol it uses, but apparently it does rolling encryption.
[975.38 --> 978.44]  So you can't just sniff it with 433 or something like that.
[979.40 --> 983.94]  So what I'm tempted to do is get an ESP device and kind of solder a couple of leads on and have
[983.94 --> 985.76]  that kind of fake button pushes.
[985.96 --> 990.30]  But I don't want to break the only remote that I have for the thing.
[990.30 --> 995.70]  I wonder if you could get like a replacement remote, a second remote that one to play with
[995.70 --> 997.92]  and one to be, you know, your production remote.
[998.08 --> 998.20]  Yeah.
[998.50 --> 1001.62]  If anybody has any experience with those Velux remotes, I'd love to hear from you.
[1001.98 --> 1003.40]  Self-hosted.show slash contact.
[1003.40 --> 1008.70]  Humio.com slash H-C-E.
[1008.88 --> 1012.06]  Go there to get all of your logs in one place.
[1012.74 --> 1016.24]  Humio is a centralized log management and observability platform.
[1016.50 --> 1021.52]  The company was founded by developers in Denmark in 2016 as an alternative to the legacy logging
[1021.52 --> 1023.48]  solutions that I tried back in my day.
[1023.92 --> 1027.70]  They're just cost prohibitive and unbelievable in scale and size.
[1027.70 --> 1032.40]  I think the real beauty of Humio is that it can take logs from any source and then it makes
[1032.40 --> 1032.98]  them usable.
[1033.22 --> 1036.18]  You don't have to sit there and constantly massage the format.
[1036.34 --> 1037.30]  It doesn't need a schema.
[1037.54 --> 1039.26]  You just pump them all in there.
[1039.38 --> 1043.04]  And then when you need them, the dashboard helps you get sense of it.
[1043.40 --> 1046.24]  I cannot underscore this enough.
[1046.60 --> 1051.32]  Back in my day when I was in IT, specifically in banking, where we had to audit our firewall
[1051.32 --> 1052.32]  logs constantly.
[1052.76 --> 1054.14]  I am not kidding you.
[1054.58 --> 1058.00]  We spent a month training the system on what to look for.
[1058.98 --> 1060.40]  That's how wild these things are.
[1060.40 --> 1062.96]  So what Humio is doing is crazy.
[1063.12 --> 1067.68]  It's index-free architecture means you can ingest over a petabyte of data per day and
[1067.68 --> 1070.72]  then search that with sub-second latency.
[1071.40 --> 1076.16]  And Humio is up to 80% cheaper than competing platforms like Splunk or Elastic thanks to its
[1076.16 --> 1077.30]  reduced hardware footprint.
[1078.14 --> 1082.42]  But really, for our audience, I think the best way to get started is the Community Edition.
[1083.24 --> 1088.92]  Humio Community Edition is the largest no-cost data ingestion offering on the market today,
[1088.92 --> 1092.86]  allowing you to ingest up to 16 gigs per day with seven days of retention.
[1093.04 --> 1093.96]  It's not a trial period.
[1094.44 --> 1095.82]  You get that for the long haul.
[1096.30 --> 1100.74]  How useful could that be when you're troubleshooting or monitoring your system or bringing everything
[1100.74 --> 1101.74]  together in one place?
[1101.78 --> 1106.78]  It's perfect for self-hosters who just want to ingest all those logs and view it on a dashboard.
[1107.66 --> 1111.60]  You've got to co-try Humio right now to see what I'm talking about and get that Community Edition
[1111.60 --> 1112.50]  for the long haul.
[1112.50 --> 1117.02]  So to do that, you go to humio.com slash hce.
[1117.70 --> 1119.86]  When it's your hobby, you want it easy.
[1120.12 --> 1122.04]  You want it quick and you want it usable.
[1122.40 --> 1123.76]  You don't want it to be a job.
[1124.08 --> 1127.10]  You want to be able to get to the bottom of things and having that all in one dashboard
[1127.10 --> 1128.14]  is beautiful.
[1128.24 --> 1130.50]  And of course, you can get metrics from Home Assistant.
[1131.12 --> 1137.82]  So go get started with Humio Community Edition right now for free at humio.com slash hce.
[1137.82 --> 1142.78]  That's H-U-M-I-O dot com slash h-c-e.
[1144.02 --> 1149.84]  Now, I was hoping to take a moment in the show just to reach out to a friend of the show,
[1149.96 --> 1150.54]  Jeff Geerling.
[1150.64 --> 1154.48]  He posted a video on his YouTube channel today about his Crohn's disease.
[1154.62 --> 1157.92]  For those of you that don't know, Jeff suffers from Crohn's disease, which is quite a debilitating
[1157.92 --> 1161.58]  disease of the intestine and gut sort of area.
[1161.96 --> 1163.14]  He hasn't been very well lately.
[1163.14 --> 1168.92]  And his latest video says he's going to drop from weekly to bi-weekly uploads of videos,
[1169.00 --> 1169.62]  that kind of thing.
[1170.46 --> 1174.92]  At this time, I don't really know what I can do to help with that other than get you lot
[1174.92 --> 1179.06]  to message him on Twitter with kind words of encouragement to say.
[1179.12 --> 1182.80]  We're all thinking of you and hope that you make it through.
[1183.82 --> 1185.18]  Yeah, I'm very sorry to hear that.
[1185.88 --> 1186.62]  Get well, Jeff.
[1186.62 --> 1192.62]  Jeff, you know, the challenge when you are running your own business and, you know, trying
[1192.62 --> 1197.58]  to do your own media empire like Jeff has, you are kind of the star of the show.
[1197.90 --> 1203.14]  And when you have health issues, it just knocks things out of whack and it takes you off the
[1203.14 --> 1203.30]  air.
[1203.40 --> 1204.72]  So I know how rough that can be, Jeff.
[1204.88 --> 1206.68]  So all my best.
[1207.34 --> 1209.44]  Gentlemen, will you entertain me for a moment?
[1209.72 --> 1213.06]  I'd love to tell you about some new Shelly devices that I have received.
[1213.06 --> 1213.80]  Oh, that's not...
[1213.80 --> 1214.80]  I'm doing jazz hands.
[1214.90 --> 1215.54]  That's not what you meant.
[1215.54 --> 1218.00]  Oh, I mean, actually, that's quite entertaining.
[1219.22 --> 1219.88]  Thank you.
[1220.20 --> 1221.06]  Thank you very much.
[1221.34 --> 1226.40]  So you guys know I have been on a trek to look at what I'm going to replace in my setup
[1226.40 --> 1231.66]  when I redo Home Assistant and redo my Z-Wave and maybe set up some ZigBag and get rid of
[1231.66 --> 1232.98]  my Home Assistant stuff.
[1233.18 --> 1237.26]  And I have been really intrigued for a long time by the Shelly stuff since you first talked
[1237.26 --> 1238.34]  about it on the show, Alex.
[1238.38 --> 1240.58]  It just seems like such a slam dunk.
[1241.86 --> 1245.22]  And recently, I talked about their temperature sensor.
[1246.22 --> 1252.10]  And the temperature sensor is really, really great because it has an e-ink display on it.
[1252.22 --> 1258.60]  And it will give you the temperature and the humidity of the room right there on the e-ink
[1258.60 --> 1259.06]  display.
[1259.32 --> 1261.78]  And that, guys, that sold me.
[1261.84 --> 1262.56]  And it's Wi-Fi.
[1262.56 --> 1265.60]  So I don't got to mess around with ZigBag or Z-Wave.
[1265.88 --> 1268.74]  Because, you know, I still I don't know why, but I'm still waiting for matter.
[1269.08 --> 1269.56]  I know.
[1269.62 --> 1269.80]  I know.
[1269.82 --> 1270.04]  I know.
[1270.36 --> 1274.52]  So I want to just go for Wi-Fi if I can and start replacing my Z-Wave devices with Wi-Fi
[1274.52 --> 1275.00]  devices.
[1275.00 --> 1280.50]  And the number one device, the number one device that I have on Z-Wave is my Aotech
[1280.50 --> 1287.48]  seven in one or six in one sensor, which is still chef's kiss the best sensor out there.
[1287.48 --> 1290.30]  But I want to replace Z-Wave devices with Wi-Fi devices.
[1290.30 --> 1295.04]  And the Shelly H&T sensor, humidity and temperature sensor, seem like the way to go.
[1295.14 --> 1296.36]  E-ink display seems great.
[1296.36 --> 1301.20]  It has USB-C for power so you can supply always on power.
[1301.30 --> 1302.18]  You don't have to use battery.
[1302.98 --> 1308.56]  As probably a lot of you know, traditionally, that means that if you can give USB power to
[1308.56 --> 1311.58]  one of these IoT devices, they will send continuous data.
[1311.84 --> 1317.02]  And if they're on battery, they have maybe they'll wake up when a certain threshold is
[1317.02 --> 1317.34]  reached.
[1318.08 --> 1323.16]  Maybe they wake up when a certain time threshold has been reached.
[1323.26 --> 1323.38]  Right.
[1323.42 --> 1326.00]  There's different different things that can cause them to wake up.
[1326.00 --> 1327.84]  But they don't continuously report.
[1328.46 --> 1332.64]  And so for me, like I have temperature sensors in my battery bay that I need to monitor in
[1332.64 --> 1333.42]  real time right away.
[1333.50 --> 1336.36]  I can't wait an hour to get a temperature update.
[1336.44 --> 1337.38]  I need to know right now.
[1338.54 --> 1342.62]  So anything that can be powered continuously is a win for me.
[1342.74 --> 1345.92]  And the Shelly H&T sensor absolutely can.
[1347.42 --> 1350.86]  However, I have to let you know some bad news.
[1350.86 --> 1359.90]  Even when you have it plugged in over USB, sleep is still required because the CPU heat
[1359.90 --> 1362.04]  throws off the temperature readings.
[1362.32 --> 1367.66]  And so the hardware has to go in sleep mode to try to get the temperature setting or reading,
[1367.66 --> 1369.36]  I should say, as accurate as possible.
[1369.42 --> 1371.06]  That is a real shame.
[1371.50 --> 1373.48]  And do we know how long this sleep has to be?
[1373.48 --> 1378.48]  It's enough that it disconnects completely from Home Assistant and becomes a dead sensor.
[1379.44 --> 1380.52]  And it's a display.
[1380.84 --> 1381.58]  That's just no good.
[1381.88 --> 1382.06]  Yeah.
[1382.48 --> 1388.74]  If you don't want continuous data and you're okay using MQTT to kind of send it when it
[1388.74 --> 1393.96]  is alive, so that way Home Assistant doesn't freak out every time it disappears, it'll work.
[1394.40 --> 1399.32]  Now, I can't help with the e-ink side of this thing, but I mean, that looks beautiful.
[1399.48 --> 1401.16]  But first of all, $40?
[1401.98 --> 1405.76]  That's expensive for something that has this kind of a flaw in it.
[1406.94 --> 1413.50]  And when I look at it, I look at this and I think, well, you know, just use an ESP8266
[1413.50 --> 1416.70]  and a $5 sensor from China.
[1416.70 --> 1421.48]  I've been using one in my basement and one in my attic for the last three, four years.
[1421.84 --> 1423.26]  A generous listener even sent me one.
[1423.36 --> 1424.28]  You are absolutely right.
[1424.88 --> 1426.28]  And that is what I should do.
[1426.38 --> 1426.98]  I know that.
[1427.16 --> 1430.46]  But I don't know what it is, Alex.
[1430.56 --> 1433.52]  Like, I just, I can't accept it that that has to be the answer.
[1433.76 --> 1438.76]  For this to ever get any kind of mainstream acceptance, it can't be I have to go build
[1438.76 --> 1441.28]  a device and then connect it over MQTT.
[1441.28 --> 1446.50]  Like, that just can't be the answer because that's such a self-selecting set of people that
[1446.50 --> 1448.26]  can ever actually accomplish that.
[1448.50 --> 1453.52]  And it's just when I hit those walls, I go, I could do this, but I wouldn't even expect
[1453.52 --> 1455.60]  80% of the audience to do that.
[1455.74 --> 1458.26]  And they are listening to a self-hosting podcast.
[1458.62 --> 1459.76]  No, you're totally right.
[1459.98 --> 1466.88]  And it's, even when designing the 3D printed enclosures for these ESP devices, there are
[1466.88 --> 1472.34]  considerations given to the heat that even the little, you know, ESP board generates.
[1473.04 --> 1477.72]  I am very surprised that Shelley haven't been able to work around this with this device.
[1477.86 --> 1479.66]  I mean, it's very disappointing.
[1480.74 --> 1483.90]  I think what you're really suggesting is drilling a few holes in the case, aren't you?
[1483.90 --> 1491.56]  You know, the way the AOTech sensor gets around this is it's a completely different reading
[1491.56 --> 1492.06]  mechanism.
[1492.42 --> 1497.70]  It has a bulb on the front of the sensor and it projects some sort of sensor reading
[1497.70 --> 1498.36]  outwardly.
[1498.54 --> 1504.18]  So it measures out in front of the sensor and not at the sensor level like that.
[1504.18 --> 1509.14]  The Shelley is taking air into the housing and then measuring that, right?
[1509.14 --> 1515.48]  Where the AOTechs are doing some sort of like infrared projection and then measuring it some
[1515.48 --> 1517.24]  amount of feet outside of the sensor.
[1517.74 --> 1524.92]  And so for me, because the AOTechs can be plugged in over USB and report continuously, that to
[1524.92 --> 1525.60]  me is a pro.
[1526.14 --> 1532.02]  And I have to be honest with you, the old man in me is not really comfortable putting, I
[1532.02 --> 1534.70]  mean, conservatively 70 IoT devices on Wi-Fi.
[1534.70 --> 1536.86]  That just doesn't seem like it's going to scale.
[1536.86 --> 1541.36]  Where something like Z-Wave or even Zigbee, but I'm more familiar with Z-Wave.
[1541.74 --> 1547.38]  Z-Wave, every device you add to the network becomes a transmitter and a rebroadcaster.
[1547.58 --> 1549.14]  And it builds a mesh network.
[1549.26 --> 1550.62]  It makes the network even stronger.
[1551.42 --> 1556.94]  And so, and plus, like, I like having all of my, like, sensor devices and switches.
[1556.94 --> 1563.52]  I like having them off Wi-Fi because then I can reboot my DHCP server or my Wi-Fi, you know,
[1563.52 --> 1567.52]  APs or whatever, and all of my sensors and switches keep working.
[1567.90 --> 1571.64]  So I'm not actually sure Wi-Fi is the way to go for this stuff, even though that's kind
[1571.64 --> 1573.00]  of why I started looking into it.
[1573.04 --> 1577.94]  The more I use it, I don't think I, for my stuff, I don't know if I want Wi-Fi.
[1578.46 --> 1584.76]  Finding a balance, like anything, you know, certain spots in your RV will be better served
[1584.76 --> 1590.76]  by devices which are Wi-Fi based and others will be better served by Zigbee.
[1591.14 --> 1597.48]  And we had some real-time feedback in the Discord from Fuzzy Mistborn about the Akara Zigbee
[1597.48 --> 1598.34]  temperature sensor.
[1598.62 --> 1600.46]  Now, I've been using a couple of these myself, actually.
[1600.94 --> 1604.10]  I've got one in my fridge and one in my freezer.
[1604.36 --> 1609.38]  And the one in the freezer runs out of battery because the battery gets too cold almost all
[1609.38 --> 1609.78]  the time.
[1610.08 --> 1616.60]  So I know that my freezer is fine because the battery is zonked out, the voltage is too
[1616.60 --> 1616.78]  low.
[1616.84 --> 1620.38]  So as soon as that sensor comes back online, then I know that it's warmed up.
[1620.58 --> 1621.12]  Oh my goodness.
[1623.48 --> 1627.94]  But the fridge one works well at, you know, that sort of 5 Celsius sort of temperature,
[1627.94 --> 1628.96]  it works just fine.
[1629.56 --> 1631.26]  At minus 18 Celsius?
[1632.28 --> 1633.50]  I mean, that's tough.
[1634.48 --> 1638.42]  Since they're watching live, I'd love to know, does it take USB power and can it do continuous?
[1638.42 --> 1640.72]  Because if it does, I might pick that up.
[1641.18 --> 1643.22]  No, it uses one of those little coin cell batteries.
[1643.58 --> 1645.00]  I love the continuous data.
[1645.16 --> 1646.00]  I really do.
[1646.18 --> 1649.66]  I don't want hour gaps because what you get in the charts, for one thing, is like these
[1649.66 --> 1651.14]  inorganic jumps.
[1651.70 --> 1656.40]  And I really want to see, like, I immediately, it just, this was relevant just two weeks ago
[1656.40 --> 1656.74]  for me.
[1657.04 --> 1660.56]  I want to know immediately if the changes I have made are lowering the temperatures.
[1660.74 --> 1661.36]  I can't wait.
[1661.60 --> 1667.16]  So I'd love to try something Zigbee, though, that could be battery or USB and could give me
[1667.16 --> 1670.80]  real-time data and has a direct integration, doesn't require MQTT.
[1671.02 --> 1672.92]  If anybody knows, I'll try it here at the studio.
[1673.50 --> 1674.64]  What are they using on Mars?
[1674.82 --> 1675.80]  Can we get our hands on that?
[1676.22 --> 1678.66]  They are using Zigbee on Mars.
[1678.88 --> 1680.76]  I have an inkling that they are, yeah.
[1681.98 --> 1683.82]  I bet they have temperature sensors, right?
[1683.82 --> 1685.04]  That's what I'm saying.
[1685.28 --> 1686.28]  We know some people.
[1686.54 --> 1687.78]  We might be able to get samples.
[1688.42 --> 1688.92]  Yeah, maybe.
[1689.40 --> 1689.76]  Maybe.
[1689.88 --> 1690.88]  We'll find out about that.
[1690.88 --> 1695.60]  But if you wanted to use the device directly without Home Assistant and maybe just wanted
[1695.60 --> 1700.26]  to use the app for the humidity and temperature sensor, or you're comfortable just using MQTT
[1700.26 --> 1704.50]  or maybe replacing the firmware, these are really nice temperature sensors.
[1705.14 --> 1710.12]  With the only caveat being, for me, they read a few degrees high continuously.
[1710.12 --> 1715.74]  And maybe that's because of the temperature issues I mentioned, but I had temperature sensors
[1715.74 --> 1720.60]  side by side, and the Shelly sometimes read as much as seven degrees hotter than the temperature
[1720.60 --> 1721.74]  sensor right next to it.
[1722.36 --> 1722.42]  Wow.
[1722.56 --> 1723.24]  That is a lot.
[1723.58 --> 1725.38]  So I'm holding up to the stream here.
[1725.58 --> 1729.40]  This is an ESP8266 and a DHT22.
[1730.02 --> 1733.00]  And this little setup here costs less than $10.
[1733.54 --> 1739.14]  And all you need is a couple of jumper wires, honestly, and then it's powered through a micro USB
[1739.14 --> 1740.00]  port on there.
[1740.76 --> 1745.36]  And this stuff you can order from China, from AliExpress, you know, for a couple of
[1745.36 --> 1746.68]  dollars a piece, honestly.
[1747.44 --> 1749.46]  It's super cheap if you're willing to wait for the shipping.
[1750.22 --> 1754.46]  So Chris, what I'm going to do, I'm going to make a few of these for you, and I'm going
[1754.46 --> 1757.64]  to 3D print some cases, because I'm fed up of hearing you talk about it.
[1759.06 --> 1764.30]  I'm going to 3D print this into a little case for you, and then we can use command strips,
[1764.94 --> 1768.68]  ding ding, to put this on the wall of Lady Joops, and I'll make you a couple of these.
[1768.68 --> 1769.48]  All right.
[1769.84 --> 1772.06]  You can hand them to me at the JPL meetup.
[1772.14 --> 1773.16]  Exactly what I was thinking.
[1773.56 --> 1774.46]  Hey, that's great.
[1774.70 --> 1776.70]  I'm hoping the case is going to be Levi-shaped.
[1776.92 --> 1777.70]  Just putting that out there.
[1780.14 --> 1781.52]  That's quite the print job, right?
[1781.52 --> 1783.62]  Customer requirements are the worst.
[1785.26 --> 1786.50]  Maybe it's the dog collar.
[1786.66 --> 1787.00]  I don't know what's easier to print.
[1787.00 --> 1787.88]  You're not even the customer.
[1788.40 --> 1790.32]  I'm just advocating for the customer.
[1790.86 --> 1792.76]  He does that kind of thing all the time, Alex.
[1792.80 --> 1793.58]  You've got to watch out.
[1793.62 --> 1794.14]  I know.
[1794.64 --> 1795.34]  Scope creep.
[1795.34 --> 1797.34]  Just super quickly, too.
[1797.44 --> 1798.94]  I did try the Shelly Power.
[1799.44 --> 1803.54]  Out of all the Shelly devices I have tried, this is the one.
[1804.16 --> 1805.66]  This is a great device.
[1806.04 --> 1807.68]  This is a great device.
[1808.16 --> 1809.40]  This is my new smart plug.
[1809.72 --> 1810.72]  Full stop right here.
[1811.10 --> 1815.02]  Or the cloudfree.shop version, because maybe it's the same thing.
[1815.52 --> 1818.02]  I really, really like this smart plug.
[1818.10 --> 1822.70]  So much so that I have already installed one here in the studio, as well as one at home.
[1823.06 --> 1827.24]  As I expected, it's just way better than the low-power devices, because it's always on.
[1827.30 --> 1828.88]  It's plugged into your wall outlet, right?
[1829.38 --> 1831.40]  And it doesn't have the low-power issues.
[1831.40 --> 1832.60]  It's not a temperature sensor.
[1832.70 --> 1834.80]  It doesn't need to sleep to make sure the sensor's right.
[1834.96 --> 1836.04]  It just works.
[1836.18 --> 1837.10]  You plug it in.
[1837.98 --> 1841.38]  You join the little AP that it creates with your phone, or whatever you want, your laptop.
[1841.38 --> 1846.06]  You can pull up the admin page at 192.168.33.1.
[1846.68 --> 1850.90]  It's the same for all Shelly devices, which I really appreciate having set up a bunch of them now.
[1851.52 --> 1852.04]  There you go.
[1852.08 --> 1853.78]  Is that the cloudfree.shop version you got there?
[1854.16 --> 1855.40]  This is the cloudfree one, yeah.
[1855.46 --> 1858.46]  But I have a feeling your Shelly one is in the exact same housing.
[1858.66 --> 1859.34]  Yeah, exactly.
[1859.44 --> 1863.70]  And before the cloudfree guys had it, this was a Tekken SP20.
[1864.26 --> 1867.24]  And it used to use TASMOTOR.
[1867.50 --> 1868.52]  I can't remember the name of it.
[1868.66 --> 1871.34]  But it did the man-in-the-middle flashing thing.
[1871.48 --> 1873.06]  To put the TASMOTOR firmware on it.
[1873.62 --> 1875.78]  But cloudfree ships with TASMOTOR on it.
[1875.88 --> 1877.98]  What does the Shelly firmware work well on it?
[1878.02 --> 1881.04]  Because it's got their sort of cloud stuff in it, right?
[1881.58 --> 1882.36]  I like it a lot.
[1882.42 --> 1884.94]  I think it has a really good set of built-in features.
[1884.94 --> 1891.04]  It has built into it without needing to connect to any kind of hub or home assistant or anything like that.
[1891.50 --> 1893.36]  You can do scheduled timers.
[1893.52 --> 1895.22]  You can set some advanced scheduled timers.
[1895.56 --> 1898.76]  It has webhooks, so you can integrate it with all kinds of things.
[1898.76 --> 1902.34]  It also supports Bluetooth if you don't want to mess around with Wi-Fi.
[1902.54 --> 1904.80]  And it has really good power monitoring.
[1904.96 --> 1907.68]  Really good, accurate power monitoring built into it.
[1907.90 --> 1912.98]  And it also supports advanced features like joining Wi-Fi and MQTT if you want to use that kind of stuff.
[1912.98 --> 1918.16]  And the web UI is totally usable, out of the box, and their app is not bad either.
[1918.30 --> 1921.86]  So all in all, even if you never had home assistant, these are really nice smart plugs.
[1922.46 --> 1926.64]  Now, Alex, when I was here last, we installed some Shelly devices.
[1926.80 --> 1931.90]  They were, I believe, relays that we threw into a surprising number of your light switches.
[1932.26 --> 1935.06]  Both new switches we put in and old switches.
[1935.30 --> 1937.04]  How did those do in the last two months?
[1937.38 --> 1938.18]  Well, you tell me.
[1938.84 --> 1939.74]  Did you notice them?
[1940.20 --> 1941.34]  I would say I didn't.
[1941.42 --> 1946.04]  Oh, the one in your server room, the basement that you set up to open.
[1946.34 --> 1946.86]  That one, yeah.
[1947.08 --> 1951.70]  As soon as the door opens, you open that door and the light comes on and then you close the door.
[1952.00 --> 1954.20]  And well, I tried to figure out if, well, anyways.
[1954.34 --> 1956.36]  It's like half an hour, 45 minutes on that one.
[1956.50 --> 1958.12]  It's such a wonderful thing.
[1958.12 --> 1964.98]  But I would just curious if you had any issues that you saw on a daily basis, any kind of connectivity issues or reliability issues?
[1965.14 --> 1967.50]  Nope, they just work, which is the best kind of work.
[1967.50 --> 1976.06]  That's great because if I had the DC electrical knowledge, I would wire those into all of the what we call chore lights, which are the LED lights built into the RV.
[1976.28 --> 1978.40]  I would wire a Shelly into every single switch.
[1978.98 --> 1982.00]  I just don't know anything about DC power and any of that kind of stuff.
[1982.00 --> 1983.08]  Or if I could even fit them in the wall.
[1983.08 --> 1988.20]  But those are super cool because they turn a regular wall switch into basically a smart plug.
[1988.64 --> 1992.80]  And I think that's by far and above why we all know of Shelly.
[1992.80 --> 1997.00]  I think these smart plugs might be like their second best product.
[1997.22 --> 1998.54]  I really like this thing.
[1998.64 --> 2003.30]  And then, of course, Home Assistant detects it within like three seconds once it's on your Wi-Fi.
[2003.78 --> 2007.14]  And because it doesn't go to sleep, it integrates perfectly with Home Assistant.
[2007.60 --> 2011.14]  All of the energy sensors are imported and it's working with the energy monitoring.
[2011.66 --> 2013.24]  It's really smooth.
[2013.24 --> 2020.78]  And I now have it set up here in the studio so that way when I stop recording, the fan turns on and I get a little bit of airflow.
[2021.00 --> 2022.88]  And then when we start recording, the fan turns off.
[2023.20 --> 2023.66]  Quality of life.
[2023.66 --> 2031.10]  So big thumbs up on the Shelly plugs and probably all of the devices based on the hardware platform.
[2031.30 --> 2037.58]  And also a double thumbs up because the things actually can handle a decent amount of throughput of power.
[2038.10 --> 2042.34]  Not all these smart plugs can actually handle the full capacity of a wall plug.
[2042.60 --> 2043.36]  But these ones can.
[2045.00 --> 2047.04]  Linode.com slash SSH.
[2047.14 --> 2050.02]  Go there to get $100 in 60-day credit on a new account.
[2050.14 --> 2051.64]  And it's a great way to support the show.
[2051.64 --> 2055.16]  Linode is the Linux Geeks Cloud with 11 data centers worldwide.
[2055.36 --> 2061.16]  They've been hard at work for nearly 19 years creating the best experience to run applications on Linux.
[2061.34 --> 2069.16]  And as a self-hoster, I've been using it this summer when things get too hot in my quote-unquote data center, which is my garage here at the studio.
[2069.96 --> 2073.64]  And I just, I did this last year and it worked again brilliantly this year.
[2074.08 --> 2076.14]  I did not get the cooling system in.
[2076.22 --> 2078.14]  Just wasn't on the to-do list.
[2078.22 --> 2078.70]  Well, it was.
[2078.76 --> 2079.44]  It's just way down.
[2079.74 --> 2080.30]  Way, way down.
[2080.30 --> 2082.12]  Way down on the to-do list.
[2082.82 --> 2084.02]  And you know what?
[2084.52 --> 2086.82]  What I've done in the meantime has worked perfectly.
[2087.26 --> 2090.48]  I've migrated a couple of services to Linode, the ones I really need, right?
[2090.54 --> 2092.48]  Not like everything, but like the ones I really need.
[2092.52 --> 2094.98]  I put them up on Linode during the summer and I don't worry about it.
[2095.46 --> 2096.54]  It's so great.
[2096.54 --> 2102.14]  And of course, anything that's customer-facing, quote-unquote, but you know, really listeners, that's all on Linode.
[2102.28 --> 2105.42]  We would only put that stuff on Linode because the performance matters to us.
[2105.76 --> 2107.22]  And Linode's performance is top-notch.
[2107.82 --> 2112.96]  Not just me saying that, but review after review of independent industry bodies also says it.
[2113.24 --> 2115.40]  I just wouldn't host all my stuff there if it wasn't the case.
[2115.40 --> 2117.28]  And they're always rolling out new features.
[2117.46 --> 2118.94]  They have VLAN support.
[2119.06 --> 2121.88]  They have MVME storage if you want super fast storage.
[2122.00 --> 2123.62]  A powerful DNS manager.
[2123.74 --> 2124.68]  Kubernetes support.
[2124.82 --> 2125.72]  Terraform support.
[2126.22 --> 2129.00]  Of course, you can even do a bare metal system if you want.
[2129.34 --> 2134.22]  And probably the service I use, besides just the hosting the most, is their S3-compatible object storage.
[2134.66 --> 2135.90]  Changes the game on backups.
[2136.26 --> 2142.00]  It's also how we do the backend file storage for our Nextcloud instance and Matrix and Peer2.
[2142.34 --> 2144.96]  Like, it's just, object storage is the best.
[2145.46 --> 2148.78]  And Linode has a fantastic, super fast S3-compatible implementation.
[2149.36 --> 2156.40]  And with pricing 30% to 50% cheaper than the hyperscalers that want to lock you into their crazy clouds, it just makes so much sense.
[2156.40 --> 2157.64]  Especially for us self-hosters.
[2158.08 --> 2159.68]  It's the type of system we want.
[2159.80 --> 2160.20]  You know what I mean?
[2160.62 --> 2163.74]  It's not like these weird dashboards where everything has its own unique name.
[2163.82 --> 2164.50]  That's their brand.
[2164.50 --> 2166.12]  And it's a Linux box.
[2166.30 --> 2167.18]  And you can get access to it.
[2167.20 --> 2168.60]  And you can build the applications you need.
[2168.86 --> 2170.68]  One-click style or from the ground up.
[2170.86 --> 2174.86]  It's all over there, along with hundreds of guides, tutorials, and the best support in the business.
[2175.26 --> 2176.04]  That's why I love them.
[2176.22 --> 2177.12]  And I think you will, too.
[2177.64 --> 2178.36]  Go try them today.
[2178.64 --> 2179.22]  Learn something.
[2179.46 --> 2180.14]  Support the show.
[2180.50 --> 2181.44]  Maybe deploy something.
[2182.40 --> 2184.82]  Linode.com slash SSH.
[2184.82 --> 2187.00]  Go there to get that $100 and support the show.
[2187.16 --> 2191.00]  Once again, Linode.com slash SSH.
[2191.00 --> 2196.76]  Well, I'm fresh back from London where I saw an awful lot of you lovely people.
[2197.00 --> 2201.86]  We did a bit of a recap in Linux Unplugged episode 470.
[2202.30 --> 2206.28]  You can go and catch that over at linuxunplugged.com slash 470.
[2207.12 --> 2209.66]  There was about 75 people showed up.
[2209.78 --> 2210.64]  It was a pretty good turnout.
[2210.86 --> 2214.04]  Those that turned up got stickers, limited edition stickers.
[2214.04 --> 2216.10]  However, I had some left over.
[2216.80 --> 2223.48]  And so the wonderful Brent, who's with me here this evening, is going to be transporting them across the continent.
[2223.92 --> 2224.24]  It's true.
[2224.36 --> 2230.48]  To the West Coast and handing them out like candy, hopefully, on the West Coast road trip that's coming up.
[2230.56 --> 2231.48]  Those are great stickers.
[2231.62 --> 2232.20]  So that's great.
[2232.58 --> 2233.94]  Do we know how many are left to give out?
[2234.94 --> 2238.86]  I think I've got two packs of 50 or 75 left.
[2239.14 --> 2240.42]  I can't remember exactly.
[2241.10 --> 2242.20]  But it's about 100.
[2242.68 --> 2243.40]  Sounds great.
[2243.40 --> 2246.60]  I want to do something new on this West Coast road tour we're doing.
[2247.26 --> 2251.80]  I want to, just throughout the trip, four or five geocaches.
[2251.92 --> 2254.80]  I just want to drop off and hide them and then leave hints on the show.
[2255.36 --> 2259.88]  So even locals who couldn't make it to a meetup, maybe they could go find the stuff we geocached somewhere.
[2260.08 --> 2263.52]  And, of course, it'd be like a Tupperware container full of swag, obviously.
[2264.12 --> 2265.44]  I think that'd be a lot of fun.
[2265.64 --> 2265.74]  Yeah.
[2265.84 --> 2270.06]  So that might be something we'd do along our West Coast meetup road tour, which is coming up.
[2270.06 --> 2272.02]  Meetup.com slash Jupyter Broadcasting.
[2272.02 --> 2273.50]  We'll be giving out swag.
[2273.64 --> 2279.98]  We have four or five, I don't know, meetups planned, including one at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory.
[2280.42 --> 2282.98]  We're going to meet up around that area as well.
[2283.04 --> 2286.80]  So if you can't make it to JPL, not everybody will because it's a small crowd.
[2287.14 --> 2288.64]  We'll still have a meetup in that area, though.
[2288.66 --> 2289.64]  So you can come hang out with us.
[2289.64 --> 2292.30]  All the details are at meetup.com slash Jupyter Broadcasting.
[2292.30 --> 2299.32]  We haven't talked too much about the JPL stuff in this show because it was mostly a Linux Unplugged venture, I think, to start with.
[2299.54 --> 2312.50]  But the head of the Mars Copter project, I think his brother listened to Linux Unplugged and put this gentleman in touch with you, Chris, and reached out and said,
[2312.50 --> 2317.30]  Hey, I'm the head of the Linux aspect of the Mars Copter.
[2317.48 --> 2320.32]  Like, do you want to come see my workplace?
[2320.46 --> 2321.86]  And we're like, yes, we do.
[2321.98 --> 2322.52]  Yes, please.
[2322.52 --> 2322.96]  Yeah.
[2324.78 --> 2327.18]  And they have tours that they set up for the public.
[2327.30 --> 2328.24]  I mean, anybody can go.
[2328.66 --> 2330.92]  And those are limited to a certain amount of people.
[2331.06 --> 2336.20]  So we figured, OK, we'll do kind of a throw your name in the hat sort of thing.
[2336.30 --> 2342.42]  And then Wes is going to write us a little Python script that will go through, randomize everybody's names and create a list.
[2342.44 --> 2343.76]  And then we'll also create a backup list.
[2343.82 --> 2345.76]  So it's worth putting your name in the hat.
[2345.94 --> 2347.40]  Jeez, I hope I win.
[2348.16 --> 2348.90]  Yeah, you're in.
[2348.98 --> 2349.28]  Don't worry.
[2349.94 --> 2350.50]  You're in.
[2350.80 --> 2352.28]  I don't know about that Brent guy, though.
[2352.28 --> 2353.30]  Yeah, yeah.
[2353.40 --> 2354.42]  Loose cannon over there.
[2354.70 --> 2358.32]  Yeah, he better go to self-hosted.show slash JPL to get his name in the hat.
[2358.38 --> 2358.72]  I'm gone.
[2359.00 --> 2361.82]  But yeah, that's the next thought instance that we're hosting just for this kind of stuff.
[2362.10 --> 2368.26]  Now, we are planning some extra meetups in Pasadena, LA sort of area around the time of the tour.
[2368.34 --> 2374.88]  So even if you aren't part of the Lucky 15 that get to go around the Chocolate Factory, please do still come out and see us.
[2374.96 --> 2378.54]  Because Brent and I had a blast last night playing trivia in a local bar.
[2378.54 --> 2382.82]  And I think it's rekindled my love of that stuff.
[2383.14 --> 2389.00]  And we might try and do, I don't know, some Linux trivia or self-hosting trivia or something like that for the audience.
[2389.00 --> 2390.62]  So keep an eye out on that.
[2390.72 --> 2391.98]  Keep an eye out on the meetups page.
[2392.64 --> 2398.50]  And I'll tell you what, after London and meeting so many listeners and things like that, you know, there were people there.
[2398.54 --> 2407.22]  There was a guy that used to work at the Apple store and he talked to me a little bit about Apple because he's listened to the show and knows that my history used to be a genius on the Genius Bar.
[2407.22 --> 2428.66]  And there was another guy there who did the soundtrack, like audio engineering for the Forza Motorsport games and just loads of super cool people that I would never, ever have gotten the chance to meet without talking into this microphone, which is just, as I said in Linux Unplugged, you know, I sit in this room talking to a screen effectively.
[2428.84 --> 2430.94]  And it feels a little disconnected from the real world.
[2430.94 --> 2436.50]  But the meetups we've done this year have really reminded me that you never know who's listening.
[2437.40 --> 2440.62]  And the people listening are really interesting.
[2440.90 --> 2441.40]  They're people.
[2441.58 --> 2443.04]  They're like, they're actual people.
[2443.56 --> 2443.88]  That's right.
[2444.10 --> 2444.20]  Yeah.
[2444.52 --> 2444.92]  Yeah.
[2444.96 --> 2447.74]  And that's, that is always really good for me to kind of reconnect with.
[2448.02 --> 2450.34]  And I think we've been missing that for the last couple of years.
[2450.34 --> 2453.20]  And that's kind of the reason why we're so excited about these meetups.
[2453.24 --> 2456.34]  And if you do have the opportunity, I think they're medically necessary.
[2456.84 --> 2458.16]  That's my, I'm a doctor.
[2458.46 --> 2459.68]  I'm a podcast doctor.
[2459.68 --> 2460.98]  And that's my medical advice.
[2461.32 --> 2468.38]  So we also have a matrix space for all these different areas that we have meetups in.
[2468.46 --> 2469.22]  So you might check that out.
[2469.26 --> 2470.12]  We'll have a link in the show notes.
[2470.18 --> 2476.80]  And specifically, we have a West Coast crew, bit.ly slash West Coast crew, where we're chatting
[2476.80 --> 2477.40]  with locals.
[2477.40 --> 2479.62]  We're talking about details for these meetups.
[2479.76 --> 2484.50]  My wife, myself, Brantley, we're all in there kind of coordinating on stuff for this road trip.
[2484.66 --> 2485.54]  So check that out as well.
[2485.58 --> 2486.46]  If you're in the area.
[2486.90 --> 2489.22]  Brent has bullied me into getting elements set up now.
[2489.22 --> 2490.14]  So I'm in there too.
[2490.46 --> 2490.74]  I did.
[2490.86 --> 2491.44]  I know.
[2491.78 --> 2492.58]  That's big.
[2492.74 --> 2493.00]  Right.
[2493.12 --> 2493.68]  That's awesome.
[2494.24 --> 2494.64]  Congratulations.
[2494.94 --> 2495.88]  Welcome into the matrix.
[2496.10 --> 2497.64]  It's the beginning of the end of discord.
[2497.86 --> 2498.24]  No, I don't.
[2498.32 --> 2499.08]  I don't know about that.
[2499.26 --> 2500.14]  I don't know about that.
[2500.26 --> 2504.36]  But I'm part of the self-hosting chat revolution at last.
[2505.02 --> 2505.26]  Woo.
[2506.26 --> 2506.78]  All right.
[2506.78 --> 2510.02]  Speaking of self-hosting and feedback, we have some boost to get into.
[2510.10 --> 2512.38]  And I want to say thank you to everybody who does boost into the show.
[2512.70 --> 2517.70]  We read them all and we share them around internally very often and talk about them.
[2518.06 --> 2525.60]  But we also we want to keep this segment tight and moving because this show is only twice a month and we don't have a long time in each episode.
[2525.60 --> 2533.08]  So what we are doing and it's a good problem to have, but we are setting a 2000 sat limit to get your boost read on air.
[2533.36 --> 2536.90]  Now, every now and then we might pull one forward that was less than that because we do read them all.
[2537.26 --> 2539.08]  But we want to keep this tight.
[2539.20 --> 2539.96]  We want to keep it moving.
[2540.08 --> 2541.94]  So we're going to set it at that limit for now.
[2542.62 --> 2543.94]  This is kind of all still an experiment.
[2544.08 --> 2546.72]  So thank you, everybody who works with us as we do this.
[2546.72 --> 2548.94]  And we appreciate all the support that's been sent in.
[2548.94 --> 2551.68]  And we're going to start with a make good boost this week.
[2551.80 --> 2554.86]  It was accidentally sent into the wrong show first.
[2554.86 --> 2558.94]  And then it was my bad because we had a whole bunch of schedule changes with travel and whatnot.
[2559.32 --> 2560.32]  And I didn't get into the show.
[2560.42 --> 2566.42]  So CB sent us in a whopping 82,997 sats.
[2566.82 --> 2567.90]  Is that a baller boost?
[2568.22 --> 2569.86]  That's definitely a baller boost.
[2569.94 --> 2572.52]  That's a that's a back home baller for sure.
[2573.14 --> 2578.86]  And CB writes, I just listed a self-hosted 74 and I cannot agree more with the home assistant platforms.
[2578.94 --> 2580.20]  Going Downhill in quality.
[2580.40 --> 2587.40]  We use Google Home Minis and we're at the point where all we use it for is like lazily checking the time.
[2587.54 --> 2590.04]  It's almost useless for anything else now.
[2590.34 --> 2591.18]  Here's an example.
[2591.32 --> 2596.22]  If my wife says, OK, Googs, make a new shopping list called Our Son's Favorite Toys.
[2596.22 --> 2600.70]  It'll say, OK, making a list called Our Son's Favorite Music.
[2601.10 --> 2605.00]  I want to pause here and say, I have the ultimate what the F moment.
[2605.00 --> 2615.60]  I asked the Siri tube what the weather is and her response was, I can't find that right now, but I've sent more information to your phone.
[2617.10 --> 2618.34]  Like what?
[2618.46 --> 2619.54]  And so then I ask her again.
[2619.58 --> 2621.42]  I'm like, that must have been like a connectivity error.
[2621.66 --> 2623.10]  So then I ask her what the time is.
[2623.12 --> 2623.32]  Right.
[2623.40 --> 2624.72]  And she tells me what the time is.
[2624.72 --> 2629.94]  So then I say, you know, hey, Siri, what's the weather tomorrow?
[2630.68 --> 2631.76]  And then she comes back.
[2631.82 --> 2633.20]  She's listening to me, of course.
[2633.40 --> 2634.94]  And then she come back.
[2635.00 --> 2640.22]  She comes back and says some air about personality settings and to check my phone.
[2640.48 --> 2644.44]  And so now I have I cannot use her for basically anything.
[2644.44 --> 2647.02]  It has continued to get worse.
[2647.48 --> 2650.20]  Initially, it was just stuff I could control with home assistant.
[2650.20 --> 2652.16]  That was what I lost completely.
[2652.52 --> 2659.06]  But now it's even the basics like the weather or like mileage, anything like that.
[2659.24 --> 2660.94]  She's just completely missing it all now.
[2661.36 --> 2663.98]  We're in trouble when the tubes get sick of your ass, huh?
[2664.60 --> 2664.92]  Yeah.
[2665.20 --> 2666.32]  Maybe she's messing with me.
[2666.36 --> 2667.92]  She's gaslighting me.
[2667.92 --> 2673.22]  My favorite feature of these tubes at the moment is the, by the way, did you know that you can?
[2674.22 --> 2674.44]  Yeah.
[2674.52 --> 2674.74]  Okay.
[2674.94 --> 2676.08]  Shut up, please.
[2676.08 --> 2682.40]  I asked you for a three word answer and I have a 45 second by the way clip that tells me all things.
[2683.14 --> 2684.00]  Shut up.
[2684.28 --> 2690.16]  I think the Echo must have like a minimum they try to get in because I use the Echo so rarely.
[2690.70 --> 2694.30]  It's literally every single time I use it, it gives me a by the way.
[2694.96 --> 2697.08]  I use it like maybe four times a week at most.
[2697.16 --> 2700.60]  And every single time I get a by the way, I can't even with this anymore.
[2700.70 --> 2701.56]  I'm so sick of it.
[2701.56 --> 2707.18]  And so CB gave us a double boost by continuing with some leet sats saying, maybe that Google
[2707.18 --> 2708.08]  employee was right.
[2708.18 --> 2712.86]  These AIs are becoming sentient and giving us terrible quality results in the form of
[2712.86 --> 2713.40]  a revolt.
[2715.28 --> 2716.26]  Love all the shows.
[2716.38 --> 2716.82]  Thank you.
[2717.02 --> 2717.64]  It may be.
[2717.78 --> 2719.46]  I don't know what's going on.
[2719.82 --> 2722.26]  What's weird is the Siri on the phone still fine.
[2722.42 --> 2725.12]  It's just the Siri and the HomePods that's totally lost its mind.
[2725.54 --> 2729.54]  You know, Alex caught me using one of the Google Home devices in a novel way.
[2729.70 --> 2730.96]  Alex, care to tell the story?
[2730.96 --> 2736.62]  I caught Brent with a Google Home strapped to a battery bank with a little power device
[2736.62 --> 2737.16]  in there.
[2737.52 --> 2740.20]  And I'm actually curious, is it just Bluetooth audio?
[2740.86 --> 2745.24]  Yeah, I've been using it as a Bluetooth speaker and turned the microphone off because I don't
[2745.24 --> 2746.84]  want all that interruption.
[2747.16 --> 2749.26]  Which it moans about every time you turn it on.
[2749.36 --> 2749.78]  It's true.
[2749.84 --> 2750.42]  By the way.
[2750.56 --> 2753.36]  By the way, did you know you could turn the microphone on?
[2754.26 --> 2756.58]  I turned it off by on purpose.
[2756.82 --> 2757.04]  Right.
[2757.84 --> 2759.58]  And it's actually been great.
[2759.58 --> 2763.48]  I've been carrying that thing around as I do little projects here and there all over
[2763.48 --> 2763.88]  the house.
[2763.96 --> 2764.78]  It's been fabulous.
[2765.24 --> 2766.46]  So I don't know.
[2766.70 --> 2768.26]  It doesn't even need internet connectivity.
[2768.26 --> 2773.92]  They do sell little cradles that you can pop them into that are basically USB batteries
[2773.92 --> 2776.30]  that are mounts for those things to make them portable.
[2777.02 --> 2777.42]  Okay.
[2777.50 --> 2780.72]  Now here's a couple of our last sub 2000 sats boosts.
[2780.76 --> 2782.28]  Logic boosted in with some leet sats.
[2782.86 --> 2784.64]  I think he's asking you this, Alex.
[2785.98 --> 2789.06]  He'd like to hear your take on Pihole or AdGuard.
[2789.06 --> 2793.66]  He'd like to also hear about your three different locations you're using it because he's been
[2793.66 --> 2798.46]  looking at Pihole synced up using Gravity Sync over tail scale or something like that.
[2798.82 --> 2801.30]  And he thinks he can get some redundancy with this setup.
[2801.94 --> 2807.38]  And I think he's just, I personally think he's trying to be convinced to look at AdGuard.
[2807.38 --> 2812.56]  So I read this, each Pihole synced up, like you said, using Gravity.
[2814.40 --> 2814.88]  Why?
[2815.56 --> 2818.02]  I don't know what benefit that adds.
[2818.14 --> 2820.34]  I mean, I'll just say this.
[2820.40 --> 2828.00]  Like I set up the AdGuard home instance on my firewall on OpenSense here two, three years
[2828.00 --> 2832.38]  ago, and the lists automatically update and the version automatically updates.
[2832.56 --> 2835.70]  And that really is the last bit of thought I gave to it.
[2835.70 --> 2838.36]  These lists update remotely.
[2838.90 --> 2842.32]  They are, you know, published by third parties.
[2842.50 --> 2844.16]  I'm not really involved in that process.
[2844.32 --> 2849.36]  I mean, I suppose there is some kind of a security risk potentially with people spoofing
[2849.36 --> 2852.12]  DNS entries that way or what have you.
[2852.22 --> 2855.46]  But yeah, I suppose that's the risk you take, isn't it?
[2856.22 --> 2861.82]  So I would just say I don't really worry about syncing my DNS between three sites.
[2861.82 --> 2864.54]  And I certainly don't worry about redundancy of DNS locally.
[2864.54 --> 2868.20]  Because, you know, the setup's pretty simple.
[2868.38 --> 2872.02]  Like if the firewall is out, then the internet is out.
[2872.52 --> 2874.58]  And obviously my DNS with it.
[2874.76 --> 2880.28]  So if the DNS service crashes, then I'm going to notice that pretty quickly.
[2880.28 --> 2882.52]  And I can just go in and fix that if I need to.
[2882.52 --> 2890.46]  But again, if DNS locally is down, unless I've got some kind of IP only route to my other
[2890.46 --> 2893.64]  sites, then it's always DNS.
[2894.14 --> 2897.62]  So it's, you know, it's a bit of a chicken and egg problem.
[2897.62 --> 2903.12]  And I just like to keep things simple as possible, really, just by having everything local to
[2903.12 --> 2903.68]  each site.
[2903.68 --> 2908.08]  And then that way, if something goes down on that site, it's compartmentalized.
[2908.24 --> 2909.56]  The failure is compartmentalized.
[2909.64 --> 2914.14]  The blast radius is reduced to just my house or just my mom's house or whatever.
[2914.32 --> 2916.38]  And there's the performance element of it, too, really.
[2917.00 --> 2924.06]  You know, that's probably one of the top three reasons I run a DNS server on my LAN is I don't
[2924.06 --> 2926.42]  want to send my DNS requests all the way out to my ISP.
[2926.42 --> 2928.50]  That's that's tens of milliseconds.
[2929.50 --> 2930.14]  What's that?
[2930.42 --> 2934.24]  And honestly, the same argument applies to like Kubernetes and all that kind of stuff.
[2934.34 --> 2941.18]  Like, yes, I could run the wiki in my house on a Kubernetes cluster and have it highly available
[2941.18 --> 2945.94]  and redundant and have a pie on different UPSs at different ends of the house and stuff
[2945.94 --> 2946.38]  like that.
[2946.48 --> 2949.38]  But that's a lot of work in it.
[2949.42 --> 2949.98]  Let's be fair.
[2950.10 --> 2950.72]  Let's be honest.
[2951.32 --> 2951.94]  A little too far.
[2952.24 --> 2952.82]  Yeah, maybe.
[2953.54 --> 2953.74]  Yeah.
[2953.74 --> 2953.86]  Yeah.
[2953.86 --> 2954.18]  Yeah.
[2954.58 --> 2960.38]  I asked last week just to get people's general kind of temperature on OpenSense versus BF
[2960.38 --> 2966.22]  Sense and 412 Linux with 1010 sats boosted in said, hi, gents, regarding OpenSense.
[2966.70 --> 2971.78]  I've been running OpenSense on a Protect CTLI vault.
[2972.64 --> 2973.80]  Not familiar with that.
[2974.14 --> 2974.58]  Protectly.
[2975.32 --> 2975.58]  OK.
[2976.04 --> 2980.34]  You've been doing it for about two years, completed about a dozen minor upgrades, maybe
[2980.34 --> 2983.78]  two major upgrades, and each has proceeded without interest.
[2983.98 --> 2984.34]  Issue.
[2984.64 --> 2990.14]  I just completed the upgrade to 22.7, added AdGuard, and I've been very happy with the
[2990.14 --> 2991.44]  quality of the release.
[2992.92 --> 2993.56]  All right.
[2994.04 --> 2994.80]  All right.
[2994.98 --> 2998.62]  I'm going to have to start a campaign with Wes Payne, though, because he was very set
[2998.62 --> 3002.94]  on building a bare-bones Linux box for the studio to do the firewall.
[3002.94 --> 3008.46]  Well, this is pretty interesting, actually, because just this week I switched the subnet
[3008.46 --> 3020.56]  of my local house from 192.168.16 something to 10.something subnet because my remote family members,
[3020.56 --> 3028.56]  as I talked about in the last episode, have Starlink, have Sky routers, you know, BT all
[3028.56 --> 3029.04]  in the UK.
[3029.54 --> 3036.04]  And a lot of these routers don't give you the option to customize even the DHCP range.
[3036.72 --> 3042.02]  And so a lot of them pick 192.168.0 or 168.1.
[3042.02 --> 3047.24]  And I actually had that in my local range here because I thought, oh, well, arrogantly, like,
[3047.50 --> 3051.22]  I'm going to be able to take control of all these remote networks and change them to .16
[3051.22 --> 3054.60]  or whatever, you know, to get around that.
[3054.66 --> 3058.90]  And it turned out, actually, that more often than not, when I'm remote, I don't have control
[3058.90 --> 3059.66]  over the network.
[3059.66 --> 3064.52]  And I have to deal with being on a subnet that overlaps with my local subnet here.
[3065.42 --> 3074.16]  And so by switching my subnet here to a different, totally different CIDR, I've been able to,
[3074.52 --> 3079.10]  I hope, I'll test this out over the next year or two, I guess, circumvent that issue.
[3079.34 --> 3081.00]  Now I'm using Tailscale everywhere.
[3081.68 --> 3085.10]  Otherwise, Tailscale just goes, well, there's two subnets here that are the same.
[3085.16 --> 3086.60]  I have no idea what to do with this traffic.
[3086.60 --> 3087.54]  So I'll just do nothing.
[3087.86 --> 3089.06]  I'll just do nothing with it.
[3089.76 --> 3094.98]  So coming to your point about OpenSense, the reason I mention it is because I was actually
[3094.98 --> 3098.96]  considering trying out something other than OpenSense.
[3099.38 --> 3104.76]  So maybe via OS, if you have any experience with that, I'd be really curious to hear that
[3104.76 --> 3114.34]  in the chat or via the contact forms or just creating a bog standard Linux VM with IP tables
[3114.34 --> 3120.20]  or whatever and just create the firewall rules that way myself because I'm getting a bit
[3120.20 --> 3120.78]  tired.
[3121.62 --> 3125.48]  It's only a small annoyance, but it's all the DHCP requests, right?
[3125.52 --> 3130.06]  The static leases that I've had to configure this week of clicking through the UI and not
[3130.06 --> 3135.64]  having things in an ansibilized, you know, infrastructure as code fashion.
[3135.64 --> 3140.18]  I would like to be able to just apply my config, have DNS mask and all that just taken care
[3140.18 --> 3143.02]  of and never think about it ever again.
[3143.56 --> 3147.06]  I'm so glad you touched on this because this was going to be where I go with this is it
[3147.06 --> 3152.40]  does seem like the kind of approach Wes wanted to go with would be better from an ansible
[3152.40 --> 3153.32]  management standpoint.
[3153.88 --> 3154.06]  Wow.
[3154.14 --> 3155.80]  You just dropped a lot on me.
[3155.92 --> 3160.36]  So while I'm thinking, while I'm starting to kind of give to the OpenSense idea, you're
[3160.36 --> 3164.02]  coming around to what I was talking about and we just passed each other in the night.
[3164.12 --> 3167.26]  I can't even like, oh, there's a lot of night passing happening here.
[3167.36 --> 3170.74]  I mean, you did just discover Shelley about two or three years later.
[3173.32 --> 3173.98]  That's fair.
[3174.24 --> 3174.72]  That's fair.
[3174.80 --> 3177.72]  It took it took you about two years of talking about it before I tried one.
[3177.82 --> 3180.68]  So how long have I been running PFSense slash OpenSense?
[3180.80 --> 3184.28]  It must be it must be getting on for a decade.
[3184.46 --> 3187.08]  Honestly, you know, I know the ins and outs of that thing.
[3187.08 --> 3190.56]  It's a very well-known battle-tested quantity.
[3191.78 --> 3196.72]  If I switch my firewall to something other than that, then I become responsible for it.
[3197.02 --> 3199.30]  And, you know, at the moment, it's an appliance.
[3199.56 --> 3201.34]  If, you know, whilst Brent was here, it broke.
[3201.46 --> 3207.16]  I'd say go downstairs, unplug it, replug it in, and it would just reboot and be fine, most
[3207.16 --> 3207.50]  likely.
[3207.70 --> 3208.98]  So who knows?
[3209.06 --> 3210.68]  I'm not sure quite what I'm going to do yet.
[3210.78 --> 3215.70]  I don't know if I'll go to a halfway house and just move DNS mask type services onto a dedicated
[3215.70 --> 3218.60]  Pi in the rack or something and then leave OpenSense alone.
[3219.12 --> 3219.88]  That's an option.
[3220.70 --> 3226.86]  But I am a fan of having DHCP on the firewall because it just seems the logical place to
[3226.86 --> 3227.54]  put it, you know.
[3227.76 --> 3229.68]  And I like putting DNS and DHCP together.
[3229.78 --> 3229.98]  Yes.
[3230.04 --> 3230.20]  Sorry.
[3230.30 --> 3231.26]  Co-locate those two.
[3231.78 --> 3232.14]  Absolutely.
[3232.74 --> 3234.36]  Well, I'd also like to know what the audience thinks.
[3234.48 --> 3235.80]  Send us in a boost with your ideas.
[3235.94 --> 3237.10]  Pleb 3000.
[3237.38 --> 3238.84]  Send us in a row of ducks.
[3238.92 --> 3240.28]  2,222 sats.
[3240.84 --> 3242.70]  For passing on secrets after I die.
[3242.70 --> 3244.56]  Also a question that came up last week.
[3244.64 --> 3245.74]  Comes up every now and then, actually.
[3246.38 --> 3252.06]  I just use Bitwarden's emergency contact feature with an encrypted USB I give my contact in
[3252.06 --> 3254.24]  advance and I call it a day.
[3254.48 --> 3258.64]  On the bright side, if your Bitcoin fails to get passed on, then essentially that's a
[3258.64 --> 3260.04]  donation to the Bitcoin community.
[3260.78 --> 3261.42]  That's true.
[3262.22 --> 3263.74]  Everybody's value goes up, I suppose.
[3264.58 --> 3265.46]  Not lately.
[3267.12 --> 3269.62]  Well, no, what he means is there's less Bitcoin.
[3269.82 --> 3270.42]  No, I know.
[3270.42 --> 3273.84]  Yeah, right.
[3274.08 --> 3277.12]  Jason boosts in with 2,827 sats.
[3277.50 --> 3281.90]  Plus one for Alex's RJ45 ends with the wires that pass through.
[3282.34 --> 3283.48]  They cost a little more.
[3283.68 --> 3288.82]  Oh, and you have to get yourself a new crimping tool or cut the wires with scissors, but it's
[3288.82 --> 3289.82]  totally worth it.
[3290.26 --> 3292.56]  It's way better than the classic style.
[3292.70 --> 3293.26]  I agree.
[3293.76 --> 3295.80]  Yeah, totally, totally worth it.
[3295.88 --> 3298.32]  Thank you, everybody who boosted in under 2,000 sats.
[3298.40 --> 3299.42]  We did read your message.
[3299.42 --> 3301.22]  Some of you I followed up with on Matrix.
[3302.08 --> 3304.70]  And thank you for being flexible while we try this out.
[3304.78 --> 3311.94]  If you want to grab a podcast app that supports boosts, newpodcastapps.com, or be a nerd and
[3311.94 --> 3314.06]  use boost CLI and boost from the command line.
[3314.48 --> 3314.70]  All right.
[3314.76 --> 3318.06]  Well, Brentley, are you going to be with us for the next episode or are you probably out
[3318.06 --> 3318.50]  of here by then?
[3318.76 --> 3319.08]  I am.
[3319.12 --> 3320.52]  But am I going to be with you by then?
[3321.82 --> 3323.04]  Maybe the one after that.
[3323.16 --> 3324.06]  Maybe the one after that.
[3324.28 --> 3324.54]  Yeah.
[3324.90 --> 3326.56]  You got to go home for a little bit, don't you?
[3326.56 --> 3328.04]  I guess I have cats at home somewhere.
[3328.80 --> 3330.72]  Eventually, Border Patrol will come looking for you.
[3331.08 --> 3334.22]  When will he realize that van life is the way?
[3334.22 --> 3334.72]  I know.
[3335.20 --> 3335.86]  You know what?
[3336.28 --> 3339.86]  The audience emails me that and asks, when's Brent going to figure it out?
[3340.08 --> 3342.26]  Just email me a van and I'll do it.
[3343.02 --> 3344.64]  3D print it while you're at Alex's, right?
[3344.64 --> 3347.66]  I even offered him the use of my workshop here to kit the damn thing out.
[3347.84 --> 3349.88]  It's true, but it's filled with gulfs now.
[3350.82 --> 3351.42]  It is.
[3351.62 --> 3351.86]  Yeah.
[3352.08 --> 3352.90]  What are you going to do there?
[3352.96 --> 3354.34]  I think he really needs a short bus.
[3354.56 --> 3357.02]  I mean, you know, seriously, a little short bus, diesel or something like that.
[3357.02 --> 3358.90]  You just want me to live the life you want.
[3359.58 --> 3360.10]  That's right.
[3360.44 --> 3361.78]  No, I want to vicariously through you.
[3361.78 --> 3362.58]  You are squandering.
[3362.76 --> 3364.86]  And this, I'm sorry, I'm going to get on my soapbox for a second.
[3365.28 --> 3368.02]  You are squandering the single life right now.
[3368.62 --> 3373.68]  Chris and I are sat over here looking at you with the kid factor thinking, if only.
[3373.68 --> 3379.40]  If only we didn't have the responsibilities of that fan, which we love very much.
[3380.08 --> 3380.84]  We'd be on the road.
[3381.28 --> 3384.76]  Well, listeners, write in with your single Brent advice and I'll consider it.
[3386.44 --> 3388.56]  And you can always tell him in person, too.
[3388.62 --> 3391.28]  He'll be at the JPL and the meetups.
[3391.42 --> 3394.36]  Go to meetup.com slash Jupiter Broadcasting for more deets on that.
[3394.82 --> 3397.68]  And thank you to our members, our site reliability engineers.
[3397.86 --> 3399.26]  You guys make the show possible.
[3399.50 --> 3402.52]  You give us the runway to negotiate with the sponsors we want to talk to.
[3402.52 --> 3409.74]  And as a thank you, we have an ad free feed for Chew with a post show attached to that with more features coming at the end of the year.
[3410.18 --> 3412.56]  So to become a member, support the show and keep us going.
[3412.70 --> 3416.70]  Self-hosted dot show slash SRE.
[3417.02 --> 3418.34]  That was a long slash.
[3419.14 --> 3420.24]  It's just one slash.
[3420.72 --> 3423.52]  I really want them to know they have to put a slash in there.
[3423.58 --> 3425.86]  It won't work if they just do self-hosted dot show SRE.
[3425.86 --> 3427.64]  You know, you got to have the slash in there.
[3428.18 --> 3429.28]  You got to have the slash.
[3429.86 --> 3436.16]  Now, I just want to underscore how grateful I am to all of you that didn't already hear my thanks in Linux Unplugged.
[3436.16 --> 3444.28]  That you came to the meetups, you know, not only the London one, the micro rally one that we had as well, where four or five people showed up.
[3444.42 --> 3445.12]  That was pretty nice.
[3446.08 --> 3447.84]  It's really energizing those kinds of things.
[3447.94 --> 3455.04]  I know we keep talking about meetups lately on the network, but I think with everything that's happened in the last two or three years, we have to get out again.
[3455.10 --> 3461.54]  We have to get out of our caves and go and see each other and actually have real life conversations because there were topics that came up.
[3461.54 --> 3465.60]  Would you believe we actually had a rational conversation about snaps at the London meetup?
[3466.48 --> 3470.34]  Isn't that interesting how these things come up and everybody just has real human conversations?
[3470.54 --> 3471.30]  Nobody gets upset.
[3471.56 --> 3471.92]  Absolutely.
[3472.08 --> 3473.06]  There was no mudslinging.
[3473.12 --> 3474.34]  It was just, I think it's stupid.
[3474.52 --> 3475.02]  Okay, cool.
[3475.08 --> 3475.92]  Why do you think it's stupid?
[3476.62 --> 3478.28]  Rather than, oh, you're an idiot.
[3478.44 --> 3479.52]  No, you know, like you would be on radio.
[3479.52 --> 3480.20]  No, you're an idiot.
[3481.14 --> 3481.80]  I know that.
[3481.80 --> 3482.66]  But, you know.
[3483.40 --> 3489.28]  Anyway, my point is, if you can possibly make the effort to come out to the West Coast and see us all, please do.
[3489.42 --> 3490.20]  We'd love to see you.
[3490.20 --> 3494.14]  Until then, let's hear from you at self-hosted.show slash contact.
[3494.92 --> 3499.70]  And if you have anything else, any other feedback or anything like that, you can find me on Twitter at Ironic Badger.
[3500.32 --> 3502.00]  I'm over there at Chris LAS.
[3502.38 --> 3504.00]  And I'm at Brent Gervais.
[3504.10 --> 3505.44]  If you can spell it, you win a prize.
[3505.44 --> 3508.64]  If you know Ricky Gervais, you know, you might.
[3509.40 --> 3510.42]  He hates it when I say that.
[3510.48 --> 3511.04]  I'm sorry, Brent.
[3511.32 --> 3514.94]  The prize is you get Brent's stuff in your feed, by the way.
[3516.36 --> 3516.80]  Congratulations.
[3516.80 --> 3517.04]  Congratulations.
[3517.60 --> 3519.50]  The podcast is at self-hosted show.
[3519.64 --> 3523.90]  And there is also a network one, you know, for like all the other shows that we do.
[3523.94 --> 3525.48]  There's a lot of other shows at Jupiter Signal.
[3525.66 --> 3526.02]  I don't know.
[3526.18 --> 3526.58]  Figure it out.
[3527.52 --> 3528.38]  You figure it out, eh?
[3528.58 --> 3529.56]  You figure it out.
[3530.30 --> 3531.40]  Thanks for listening, everybody.
[3531.40 --> 3534.24]  That was self-hosted.show slash 77.