[0.00 --> 4.32]  Well, here we are, fresh back from Denver. We're joined by Brent again, who's still hanging around.
[4.56 --> 6.52]  And Chris, hey, hi, how are you doing, gentlemen?
[7.12 --> 8.74]  Hello. Hey, Brent, thanks for coming in again.
[8.96 --> 10.36]  Hey, thanks. It's good to be here.
[10.40 --> 14.46]  You're like our de-Google correspondent, and we're going to be talking a lot about that this week.
[14.76 --> 15.44]  Beep-de-beep, beep-de-beep.
[15.50 --> 16.34]  Beep-beep-beep-beep-beep.
[18.38 --> 22.52]  Yeah, well, my dumbass mentioned de-Googling just the week before.
[22.64 --> 26.36]  We're taking a massive trip, and I'd have zero hours to actually do any prep for the episode.
[26.96 --> 33.50]  Luckily, the audience saw fit to write in with about 800 emails telling us all the different ways that they're doing it.
[33.56 --> 37.20]  So we're going to come across some of those later on in the show.
[37.72 --> 39.40]  But in the meantime...
[39.40 --> 44.72]  This episode is brought to you by a Cloud Guru, the leader in learning for the cloud, Linux, and other modern tech skills.
[44.98 --> 47.06]  Hundreds of courses and thousands of hands-on labs.
[47.34 --> 50.66]  Get certified, get hired, get learning at a cloudguru.com.
[51.14 --> 52.88]  I followed through on my challenge, Alex.
[52.88 --> 65.00]  I de-Googled my map experience, which was crazy because we are on the road, and I was navigating Denver and now Colorado Springs for the entire time, the duration of this challenge.
[65.36 --> 69.06]  So I will report back on my results when we get to the feedback.
[69.50 --> 73.84]  But I think we should start with this news story that, I don't know, it's kind of a bummer, actually.
[74.24 --> 75.64]  I was really sad to see this, yes.
[75.64 --> 83.84]  Back in episode 33, we did a review of the Helios 64 Ultimate Arm-Powered NAS.
[84.64 --> 88.70]  And unfortunately, the Cobalt team today have announced on their blog that they're pulling the plug.
[89.20 --> 90.50]  Yeah, no more.
[90.60 --> 94.28]  They're not even going to do the next batch that there's already orders in the pipeline for.
[94.36 --> 96.50]  They say it really comes down to just two key points.
[96.50 --> 103.88]  There's ongoing difficulties with manufacturing and procuring parts and costs of getting higher and higher.
[104.56 --> 105.42]  That's been a problem.
[105.50 --> 107.52]  And they say, number two, they made a rookie mistake.
[107.70 --> 109.12]  They stretched themselves too thin.
[109.64 --> 112.92]  They essentially went into the Helios 64 while just being a three-man show.
[113.12 --> 115.14]  And they should have brought more people on board.
[115.42 --> 116.36]  And they burned out.
[116.36 --> 123.62]  You know, we got a really interesting insight into this manufacturing difficulties during our System76 factory tour last week,
[123.82 --> 131.88]  where Jeremy, who is the guy that designed some of the firmware chips and some of the firmware itself for the launch keyboard,
[132.04 --> 139.34]  was saying that they had to redesign on the fly two or three times some of the circuitry in that keyboard
[139.34 --> 142.36]  because parts would go out of stock within hours.
[142.36 --> 149.88]  And that he decided in the end to go ahead and order several, you know, hundred units of the parts they needed
[149.88 --> 155.20]  before he'd actually finished the firmware so that it didn't go out of stock before he finished writing the code.
[155.38 --> 161.72]  So if that's what System76 are up against, then they're probably a much larger player in this space than COBOL.
[162.60 --> 164.94]  I can only imagine some of the issues that those guys are having.
[165.20 --> 169.36]  It's a shame, though, because I think there's a lot of passion for an ARM-powered NAS,
[169.36 --> 172.88]  specifically for those of us who are looking for low-power solutions.
[173.54 --> 177.18]  We had some hopes that Helios was going to produce that for us.
[177.44 --> 180.96]  Well, I think this speaks to some motivations that I've been feeling lately,
[181.12 --> 185.12]  particularly after the last week getting the tour of the factory and seeing all the CNC machines
[185.12 --> 187.22]  and all the powder coating stuff.
[187.40 --> 191.56]  And, I mean, if ever you get the chance to be in Denver and do a tour of System76,
[192.44 --> 194.08]  I'm not affiliated with them in any way.
[194.20 --> 195.86]  You know, they're not a sponsor of the show or anything,
[196.36 --> 198.22]  although they do sponsor other JB shows.
[198.22 --> 199.62]  Just Coder, but yeah.
[200.12 --> 201.42]  Oh, just Coder. That's right.
[201.88 --> 203.74]  I mean, you know, maybe we should have them sponsor this show,
[203.82 --> 207.86]  because those Thaleoses would make great NASes, so maybe they should be.
[208.70 --> 211.20]  It was a truly inspirational experience for me.
[211.24 --> 216.40]  So I'm sat here thinking, okay, COBOL, who was my hope, my light in this space,
[216.46 --> 218.20]  has just bowed out.
[218.30 --> 223.16]  Maybe Alex should start a company and build the ultimate NAS.
[223.36 --> 224.68]  You know, maybe I should do that.
[224.68 --> 226.98]  I think you've got a little bit of experience, Alex,
[227.08 --> 229.96]  and some trials and tribulations that you've gone through already,
[230.08 --> 231.20]  so maybe you're perfectly suited.
[231.46 --> 234.16]  You could prototype 3D print the enclosure.
[234.52 --> 236.26]  Well, you know, that was one of the things that struck me.
[236.32 --> 239.26]  I know this is turning into a System76 factory tour recap,
[239.56 --> 242.70]  but this is one of the things that struck me most during that tour, actually.
[242.78 --> 245.50]  I asked them, you know, do you use 3D printing for your prototypes?
[245.94 --> 249.16]  And they were like, well, no, it's just easier to do it in metal, isn't it?
[249.52 --> 250.36]  And I'm like, is it?
[250.36 --> 251.96]  Yeah, they used to.
[252.20 --> 253.48]  Back in the day, they did.
[253.68 --> 256.40]  I think one of the realities is that it's, with the equipment they have,
[256.44 --> 258.12]  it's faster to make it out of metal.
[258.30 --> 260.88]  It is really, you know, I think the reason why you keep coming back to it, Alex,
[260.94 --> 266.40]  is because it is so hard to appreciate the amount of work that goes into manufacturing,
[266.68 --> 268.08]  and that's an obvious thing to say.
[268.50 --> 273.80]  But when you go to the factory, and you see every little thing they had to consider,
[273.80 --> 277.90]  and when they're bringing things in as a block of aluminum,
[277.90 --> 280.76]  and what's coming out on the other end is a keyboard or a case,
[281.44 --> 286.04]  you really have no idea how intricate that process is until you see it.
[286.52 --> 290.54]  And I think that's what is probably, I mean, that's what's resonated with me and stuck with me,
[290.56 --> 292.10]  and I got to imagine probably for you, too.
[292.66 --> 296.16]  Yeah, well, one example was Carl, who is the founder of System76.
[296.58 --> 300.40]  I was just stood next to a shelf with loads of different parts in it,
[300.40 --> 304.26]  and I picked up, like, an innocuous little nameplate, you know,
[304.28 --> 306.28]  about the size of a dog tag or something like that,
[306.62 --> 310.22]  and he jumped straight into a five-minute discussion telling me about all the different,
[310.38 --> 312.80]  you know, reasons why they pick that particular size,
[313.26 --> 315.58]  how it goes through their laser etching machine,
[315.74 --> 318.20]  and how they're considering doing direct engraving instead,
[318.32 --> 319.12]  and all that kind of stuff.
[319.14 --> 323.50]  And I'm like, wow, if that's the amount of thought that goes into a nameplate,
[323.50 --> 324.92]  or a serial number plate,
[325.80 --> 330.38]  this is going to be a big mountain to solve if I want to try and do it myself.
[330.68 --> 332.44]  That's what I take from it.
[332.48 --> 335.02]  You take from it, hmm, maybe Alex could make a Nash.
[335.06 --> 335.72]  That could be cool.
[335.82 --> 338.80]  I take from it, oh, my God, I would have to build a factory,
[338.80 --> 340.70]  and I would have to learn all this stuff.
[341.12 --> 342.70]  Oh, well, that sounds fun, doesn't it?
[342.96 --> 344.18]  Daunting, but fun.
[344.66 --> 346.88]  Yeah, if I had another life,
[347.52 --> 350.60]  if I had, like, you know, another hundred years,
[350.68 --> 352.74]  I definitely would get into it for sure.
[353.20 --> 355.46]  But you manufacture stuff every week as well,
[355.50 --> 357.04]  and you ship podcasts every week.
[357.04 --> 361.46]  Okay, you're not manufacturing aluminium into, you know, computer cases,
[362.00 --> 364.68]  but you ship and manufacture stuff just the same.
[364.92 --> 366.02]  That's true, and there have been many times
[366.02 --> 367.82]  when we refer to our production pipeline
[367.82 --> 369.42]  as kind of a manufacturing pipeline.
[369.66 --> 374.92]  And if one component is delayed or, you know, gets out of order,
[375.34 --> 376.46]  it does cause a jam up.
[376.54 --> 379.10]  There is a lot of that kind of building tech around that.
[379.18 --> 381.20]  Maybe that's why I don't have the appetite to do it again,
[381.20 --> 383.34]  but I definitely would sit here and encourage you.
[383.64 --> 385.12]  I'll be customer number one.
[386.92 --> 387.80]  I'll be number two.
[388.28 --> 390.68]  Well, there's a lot of roadblocks to overcome,
[391.30 --> 393.58]  but if I could just bring it back to Cobol for a minute,
[393.84 --> 395.80]  you know, one of the things I picked up on in my review
[395.80 --> 398.56]  was that the product wasn't 100% finished,
[398.62 --> 400.32]  and I've got to believe that with this news
[400.32 --> 403.56]  that some of the issues that were present with that NAS now
[403.56 --> 405.10]  will never be solved.
[405.24 --> 407.24]  You know, things like the backplane breaking,
[407.24 --> 410.24]  some of the plastic tabs, you know,
[410.28 --> 411.64]  the power connector and data connector
[411.64 --> 413.82]  on three of my hard drives, it turned out eventually.
[414.74 --> 417.06]  Problems with the two and a half gigabit network adapter.
[417.70 --> 419.20]  There was a bunch of other stuff as well.
[419.36 --> 420.82]  You know, you can go and listen to episode 33
[420.82 --> 421.84]  if you want the full review.
[422.52 --> 424.74]  Well, I worry now this means that some of this stuff's
[424.74 --> 425.84]  never going to get fixed.
[426.48 --> 427.32]  Do you think you killed them?
[427.46 --> 429.24]  Do you think that bad review killed them, Alex?
[430.36 --> 431.26]  You murdered them.
[431.74 --> 432.76]  Oh, don't say that.
[432.82 --> 433.82]  I mean, I didn't mean to.
[433.88 --> 434.94]  I was just trying to be honest.
[434.94 --> 438.26]  It was presented in a way that I felt was constructive
[438.26 --> 439.44]  to say that there are these,
[439.92 --> 441.52]  it's a very promising piece of hardware.
[441.64 --> 444.26]  I mean, the aluminium chassis was really lovely.
[444.90 --> 446.78]  There was just a couple of key things that let it down,
[446.84 --> 448.52]  you know, in terms of manufacturing tolerances
[448.52 --> 449.88]  and a couple of firmware things.
[450.04 --> 452.28]  But overall, they did a really great job.
[452.32 --> 455.70]  And I wish there was some way we could tell them that,
[455.74 --> 458.00]  you know, even though we weren't 100% positive,
[458.00 --> 459.82]  it was just because we loved the idea,
[459.92 --> 462.06]  not because we didn't want them to carry on and succeed.
[462.64 --> 463.26]  I agree completely.
[463.26 --> 466.52]  And they don't completely close the door in their blog post.
[466.60 --> 468.10]  We'll have that linked in the show notes if you want.
[468.16 --> 469.78]  They do kind of leave it cracked a little bit,
[469.82 --> 470.76]  like maybe it'll come back.
[471.14 --> 474.10]  But I wanted to shift gears and talk about something
[474.10 --> 476.12]  that could solve a big problem for me.
[476.20 --> 478.30]  I actually went out and I pre-ordered
[478.30 --> 481.14]  a bunch of Wyze 3 cameras a long time ago.
[481.18 --> 483.74]  And I have a box of Wyze 3 cameras
[483.74 --> 485.36]  that I haven't installed
[485.36 --> 489.30]  because they do not yet have an RTMP firmware
[489.30 --> 491.72]  or an RTSP firmware for Wyze 3.
[492.06 --> 493.92]  But Alex, I think you've solved that this week.
[494.14 --> 495.86]  Yeah, I don't know where I came across this,
[495.98 --> 497.76]  but I found a Docker container
[497.76 --> 500.62]  that is called Docker Wyze Bridge.
[500.84 --> 502.12]  Link in the show notes, of course.
[502.48 --> 504.08]  And essentially what this does
[504.08 --> 507.62]  is you give it your Wyze username and password
[507.62 --> 509.86]  and it goes and sort of acts as an intermediary
[509.86 --> 512.18]  between the Wyze API and the cameras.
[512.18 --> 514.80]  And somehow it hooks into the local feed
[514.80 --> 516.00]  on the cameras on your LAN
[516.00 --> 520.22]  and then presents you with a normal RTSP stream.
[520.44 --> 522.26]  So I've just got that feeding into Blue Iris
[522.26 --> 524.28]  and it just works.
[524.78 --> 525.52]  That's fascinating.
[525.78 --> 528.18]  And yeah, it can actually do both.
[528.26 --> 530.52]  It can pull from the Wyze servers
[530.52 --> 531.68]  using your credentials.
[532.24 --> 534.00]  Or with your credentials, it can use that.
[534.10 --> 535.88]  There's a library that the app uses
[535.88 --> 538.50]  and it essentially does a discovery on your network.
[539.22 --> 541.04]  And the Wyze app does this as well.
[541.04 --> 544.24]  And if it detects the camera, it uses LAN mode
[544.24 --> 546.10]  and it just does that locally
[546.10 --> 548.20]  and avoids the cloud relay.
[548.92 --> 551.02]  And you can also in your Docker Compose,
[551.10 --> 553.30]  there is an environment variable you can pass through
[553.30 --> 555.82]  that says LAN underscore only that says,
[556.00 --> 557.84]  don't even try the remote thing.
[558.30 --> 560.66]  Only stream if you can locally detect them.
[561.06 --> 562.72]  And that was the piece I was curious about.
[562.78 --> 563.84]  That's why I dug into this.
[563.92 --> 566.04]  And that means I could absolutely do this here in the RV,
[566.22 --> 567.94]  which means I could replace these Wyze cams
[567.94 --> 568.88]  that have been giving me trouble.
[568.88 --> 570.20]  The version two was good,
[570.20 --> 572.20]  but just didn't have enough horsepower,
[572.44 --> 574.26]  didn't really work so great at night.
[574.58 --> 576.14]  And the Wyze 3 solves those.
[576.60 --> 578.54]  And with this Docker Wyze bridge,
[578.58 --> 581.32]  which seems to have a decent community around it as well
[581.32 --> 582.50]  and some active development,
[583.10 --> 585.54]  I think my problems have been solved.
[585.82 --> 587.46]  And I'll give this a go, I think,
[587.48 --> 589.28]  once we get back into our home base.
[589.28 --> 591.14]  So far as I can tell,
[591.24 --> 593.56]  it only works on the V3 cameras.
[593.80 --> 596.92]  So I've got a couple of V2s flashed with the RTSP firmware
[596.92 --> 599.02]  and a couple of V3s.
[599.12 --> 601.24]  And the app will, in its logs,
[601.36 --> 603.58]  show me a bunch of errors for the two V2 cameras.
[604.04 --> 605.68]  I don't know if that's because I'm running the,
[605.74 --> 608.60]  you know, custom firmware or whatever it is.
[609.30 --> 612.56]  But the performance with the V3s is great.
[612.66 --> 614.74]  We've been using it as a baby monitor for my daughter.
[614.74 --> 617.16]  And the night vision on there is just,
[617.50 --> 618.66]  it's like daytime.
[618.94 --> 619.86]  It's wonderful.
[620.44 --> 621.78]  They blew it out of the park with the night vision.
[622.00 --> 623.48]  It's tricky with the firmwares.
[623.62 --> 625.22]  So this is an issue.
[625.34 --> 626.30]  And I'm glad you brought it up
[626.30 --> 627.68]  because we need to mention this on the show.
[628.28 --> 630.06]  And they have it on their GitHub page.
[630.20 --> 635.24]  There is a slightly older version of the firmware for V2
[635.24 --> 637.24]  that is compatible with the bridge.
[637.38 --> 640.16]  But if you use the latest firmware for V2,
[640.68 --> 641.56]  it doesn't work.
[641.56 --> 646.82]  And that actually holds true for some instances of the V3 model too.
[646.90 --> 648.22]  So there's a version that does work
[648.22 --> 649.92]  and there's a version that doesn't work with the V3
[649.92 --> 651.90]  and the pan camera as well.
[652.28 --> 653.92]  Anyways, the links in the show notes,
[654.02 --> 655.40]  you do need to check into that
[655.40 --> 659.34]  because I may have a really old firmware.
[659.60 --> 660.60]  And so I'm going to have a hard time
[660.60 --> 663.12]  getting just the right compatible firmware in some cases,
[663.26 --> 665.20]  but they have all the information you need.
[665.92 --> 668.80]  Back in episode 48, we talked about the Pi KVM,
[668.80 --> 671.36]  you know, that wonderful Raspberry Pi
[671.36 --> 677.22]  that captures HDMI and basically acts like a BMC KVM type thing.
[677.64 --> 678.44]  Well, good news.
[678.62 --> 682.34]  Their version 3 hat has finally entered Kickstarter mode.
[682.86 --> 684.52]  It is a little pricey.
[684.78 --> 688.24]  So the main hat, which doesn't include a Raspberry Pi,
[688.80 --> 690.12]  costs $145.
[690.52 --> 693.38]  So by the time you've added a Pi as well and a case,
[693.38 --> 696.02]  it's going to be north of $200.
[697.20 --> 699.16]  But you do get a lot of useful stuff in there,
[699.22 --> 702.34]  like a USB-C bridge and CSI, you know, cables,
[702.44 --> 703.18]  all that kind of stuff.
[703.94 --> 706.82]  Now, Wendell's done a video about this on his channel on YouTube.
[707.20 --> 707.86]  So if you're curious,
[707.90 --> 709.80]  you can go and find out more about it over there.
[710.72 --> 712.12]  I do wonder about the price.
[712.14 --> 713.04]  And what do you think, Chris,
[713.24 --> 715.06]  at that sort of $200 level?
[715.06 --> 717.56]  Is that too much?
[718.40 --> 720.10]  So it looks like right now on Kickstarter,
[720.50 --> 723.90]  it's $145 and you'd get it by October 2021,
[724.20 --> 725.72]  which seems pretty reasonable to me.
[726.28 --> 731.42]  The price is, yeah, it feels high for a hat.
[732.10 --> 734.72]  Now, I think the price is a little more reasonable
[734.72 --> 736.16]  if you make the assumption
[736.16 --> 738.54]  that just about everybody already has a Raspberry Pi 4
[738.54 --> 740.80]  that would want to use something like this, right?
[740.80 --> 743.40]  If you're going to use a Raspberry Pi-powered
[743.40 --> 745.92]  keyboard video mouse switcher,
[745.92 --> 748.80]  you probably already got a couple of Pis laying around.
[749.26 --> 749.98]  So I don't think,
[750.18 --> 751.50]  I think you just kind of null that out
[751.50 --> 752.90]  because that's already a sunk cost.
[753.00 --> 754.62]  And so it really is just the $145.
[755.30 --> 758.34]  Now, you tell me, Alex, like how solid is this?
[758.40 --> 760.60]  Is this, are you still using it?
[760.66 --> 763.72]  Is it worth $145 now that you've used it for a bit?
[764.84 --> 768.72]  I'm thinking I probably couldn't get a good KVM at that price.
[769.18 --> 769.92]  I probably couldn't.
[770.02 --> 772.50]  So I'd have to go with your word though,
[772.50 --> 773.14]  if it's worth that.
[773.44 --> 775.86]  Well, I'll tell you what I'm comparing it to in my mind, at least.
[775.92 --> 779.40]  And that is a motherboard with IPMI built in.
[779.78 --> 783.34]  So I'm actually going back to England in a couple of weeks
[783.34 --> 786.44]  to go and introduce granddaughter to grandparents.
[786.96 --> 788.32]  So hello, if you're listening.
[789.12 --> 790.38]  And as part of that, I was thinking,
[790.48 --> 791.82]  well, it would be nice to upgrade my,
[791.98 --> 794.26]  you know, nearly 10 year old server in England
[794.26 --> 795.78]  with a slightly more modern motherboard
[795.78 --> 797.90]  and a slightly more modern IPMI implementation
[797.90 --> 799.42]  that isn't based around Java.
[799.42 --> 805.64]  And an eighth gen motherboard costs me around $150,
[806.28 --> 808.72]  give or take, depending on the features that I want.
[809.06 --> 811.56]  And I was looking at some ASRock rack stuff,
[811.80 --> 814.96]  which thanks to, you know, the current chip shortage
[814.96 --> 818.70]  seems to be in the $300, $250 to $300 range.
[818.70 --> 821.40]  And so if I look at that and think,
[821.52 --> 826.48]  I've got a built-in IPMI directly on the motherboard
[826.48 --> 829.56]  that I know is going to be absolutely rock solid
[829.56 --> 831.64]  versus an external device,
[831.74 --> 834.68]  which in my experience has been good,
[834.76 --> 836.38]  but it's still an external device.
[836.50 --> 837.82]  And, you know, it's another power supply.
[837.98 --> 840.44]  It's another operating system to keep updated,
[840.68 --> 841.52]  et cetera, et cetera,
[841.52 --> 844.18]  which in some respects could be a good thing.
[844.18 --> 846.00]  In other respects could be a bad thing.
[846.72 --> 848.68]  So the cost is kind of a wash, you know,
[848.72 --> 850.56]  it's about the same to get a built-in
[850.56 --> 852.36]  versus this external unit.
[853.88 --> 855.46]  Probably just go for the built-in one,
[855.60 --> 856.58]  to be honest with you.
[857.36 --> 861.06]  Except for the fact that this Pi version
[861.06 --> 862.98]  using the HDMI switch,
[863.14 --> 865.54]  which is linked in the blog post in episode 48
[865.54 --> 868.38]  that I talked about in that episode,
[869.00 --> 870.78]  I've actually got three devices
[870.78 --> 873.08]  hanging off this single Pi.
[873.08 --> 875.10]  And that has actually worked really, really well.
[875.30 --> 877.66]  So if you're able to spit that $150
[877.66 --> 879.74]  between three devices,
[880.18 --> 882.68]  suddenly that tips the scales quite a bit.
[883.30 --> 883.50]  Hmm.
[883.92 --> 885.38]  I also could see some value in there
[885.38 --> 886.96]  if you needed to add it to devices
[886.96 --> 888.86]  that IPMI wouldn't be an option.
[889.30 --> 890.04]  Like, you know,
[890.08 --> 892.44]  I'd love to have console-level access
[892.44 --> 893.90]  to my studio machines right now
[893.90 --> 894.68]  while I'm remote,
[894.76 --> 895.50]  while I'm here in Denver.
[895.92 --> 896.98]  For your other Raspberry Pis?
[897.36 --> 898.20]  Yeah, that too.
[898.40 --> 899.34]  It would be a great way
[899.34 --> 901.22]  to get console access to my Raspberry Pis.
[901.22 --> 902.00]  Oh, okay.
[902.58 --> 903.02]  All right.
[903.08 --> 904.66]  Now you're making me think
[904.66 --> 906.08]  maybe I should back this.
[907.60 --> 908.42]  Damn it, Alex.
[908.74 --> 910.62]  Well, now I've actually been in Lady Dupes.
[911.52 --> 913.42]  I've seen how you cool your
[913.42 --> 914.72]  air quotes server cupboard.
[916.74 --> 917.70]  It's pretty cool.
[920.04 --> 921.50]  Hey man, I just got to get airflow.
[921.70 --> 922.48]  That's all that matters.
[922.58 --> 923.80]  I just got to get airflow.
[924.42 --> 926.92]  How hot was it in the RV
[926.92 --> 929.08]  whilst you were parked at System76 last week?
[929.18 --> 930.40]  A hundred and seven?
[930.72 --> 931.92]  Yeah, it was a hundred and seven.
[932.04 --> 933.58]  I think the hottest we ever got in here,
[933.62 --> 934.58]  though, was actually Nebraska.
[934.78 --> 936.64]  I think it got near to 120 in here
[936.64 --> 937.72]  while we were recording.
[938.12 --> 939.40]  Which actually, it was impressive
[939.40 --> 940.90]  because the server, quote,
[941.10 --> 942.64]  room was the coolest place
[942.64 --> 944.02]  in the whole RV at that time.
[947.22 --> 949.50]  Leno.com slash SSH.
[949.50 --> 952.28]  Go there to get $100 in 60-day credit
[952.28 --> 952.90]  on a new account.
[953.22 --> 954.60]  And you go there to support the show.
[954.84 --> 955.96]  Hey guys, guess what?
[956.04 --> 957.36]  This week's episode marks
[957.36 --> 958.50]  our one-year anniversary
[958.50 --> 959.94]  going independent again.
[960.42 --> 960.70]  Yay!
[961.12 --> 961.58]  How about that?
[961.62 --> 962.38]  How awesome is that?
[962.74 --> 964.02]  It's so cool
[964.02 --> 965.90]  because Linode helped make that possible.
[966.06 --> 967.84]  Amongst our member support
[967.84 --> 968.58]  and those of you
[968.58 --> 969.52]  who went over to
[969.52 --> 971.16]  linode.com slash SSH.
[971.16 --> 972.16]  We're here now,
[972.34 --> 973.66]  rocking a year of independence.
[974.00 --> 974.76]  And Linode,
[974.96 --> 977.10]  they've been independent since 2003.
[977.48 --> 980.12]  So they've really figured this out.
[980.22 --> 982.34]  Like that's 18 years of focusing
[982.34 --> 984.22]  on just being awesome
[984.22 --> 985.56]  at cloud computing.
[985.76 --> 987.48]  They started when it was new
[987.48 --> 988.80]  and they have just evolved with it
[988.80 --> 990.06]  and they have remained competitive
[990.06 --> 991.12]  and sharp.
[991.40 --> 992.96]  They have 11 global data centers
[992.96 --> 994.60]  serving nearly a million customers
[994.60 --> 996.22]  and businesses around the globe.
[996.22 --> 997.00]  But really,
[997.20 --> 998.98]  their mission remains unchanged
[998.98 --> 1000.38]  since 18 years ago.
[1000.86 --> 1002.36]  Make cloud computing simple,
[1002.62 --> 1002.94]  affordable,
[1003.10 --> 1004.04]  and accessible to all.
[1004.36 --> 1005.74]  If you set up thousands of servers
[1005.74 --> 1006.86]  or if you've never set up
[1006.86 --> 1007.58]  a server before,
[1008.00 --> 1009.06]  Linode can make that work.
[1009.16 --> 1010.18]  I know it sounds like
[1010.18 --> 1011.04]  an impossible task.
[1011.48 --> 1012.78]  That's why I rave about them.
[1012.82 --> 1014.00]  They've really done a great job.
[1014.36 --> 1015.18]  We've been using
[1015.18 --> 1016.80]  the absolute schmeck
[1016.80 --> 1018.16]  out of their S3 compatible
[1018.16 --> 1019.08]  object storage.
[1019.52 --> 1021.20]  We created a Denver bucket
[1021.20 --> 1023.26]  and we created a System76 bucket
[1023.26 --> 1024.78]  and all of the media
[1024.78 --> 1026.40]  across multiple cameras,
[1026.56 --> 1027.46]  multiple recorders,
[1027.54 --> 1028.46]  all gets uploaded
[1028.46 --> 1029.64]  to those buckets.
[1029.96 --> 1031.02]  And then our next cloud instance,
[1031.12 --> 1031.72]  what we put on there,
[1031.78 --> 1032.90]  also saves to their S3
[1032.90 --> 1033.96]  compatible object storage.
[1034.26 --> 1035.10]  And then my system's
[1035.10 --> 1036.00]  back up there as well,
[1036.46 --> 1037.90]  right here from the RV.
[1038.24 --> 1039.04]  It's pretty awesome
[1039.04 --> 1040.62]  and it's really just a great way
[1040.62 --> 1041.34]  to use Linode
[1041.34 --> 1042.34]  and not even have to have
[1042.34 --> 1043.40]  a server running in front of it.
[1043.82 --> 1045.56]  It's sort of like,
[1045.94 --> 1046.82]  it feels like a power move.
[1047.06 --> 1048.94]  They also have a great DNS manager.
[1048.94 --> 1050.04]  They have Kubernetes
[1050.04 --> 1051.24]  and Terraform support.
[1051.36 --> 1052.46]  They have super fast networking
[1052.46 --> 1054.44]  because they are their own ISP.
[1054.78 --> 1057.02]  And their pricing is 30 to 50% cheaper
[1057.02 --> 1058.42]  than other major cloud providers
[1058.42 --> 1058.88]  out there.
[1059.40 --> 1060.72]  You know, it's also a great way
[1060.72 --> 1062.26]  to go with a multi-cloud strategy.
[1062.42 --> 1063.62]  Perhaps you want something local
[1063.62 --> 1065.86]  and you want something up in the cloud
[1065.86 --> 1067.40]  or maybe you want something
[1067.40 --> 1068.90]  across multiple cloud providers
[1068.90 --> 1070.26]  and then network them
[1070.26 --> 1071.54]  using something like Nebula.
[1072.08 --> 1073.06]  Linode can be part
[1073.06 --> 1074.16]  of that strategy as well.
[1074.38 --> 1075.48]  They made our Jupiter Colony
[1075.48 --> 1077.48]  reunion road trip possible as well.
[1077.70 --> 1079.96]  Our meetups were powered by Linode
[1079.96 --> 1081.52]  and it has been a hoot.
[1081.98 --> 1082.76]  So go sign up today
[1082.76 --> 1083.76]  and see what I've been talking about.
[1083.76 --> 1085.06]  That $100 you're going to get,
[1085.36 --> 1086.44]  you can really use that
[1086.44 --> 1087.36]  to try the service out.
[1087.44 --> 1088.40]  You can really get a feel
[1088.40 --> 1089.38]  for what it's capable of.
[1089.74 --> 1091.44]  That's $100 to really try something
[1091.44 --> 1092.22]  or learn something.
[1092.64 --> 1094.54]  Linode.com slash SSH.
[1094.72 --> 1097.00]  That's Linode.com slash SSH.
[1098.50 --> 1099.84]  Here's an email from Hans.
[1100.28 --> 1100.88]  Hans says,
[1101.00 --> 1101.64]  Hey guys,
[1101.82 --> 1103.66]  you touched upon password managers
[1103.66 --> 1105.30]  and Bitwarden in episode 51.
[1105.50 --> 1106.02]  Like Brent,
[1106.02 --> 1107.66]  I'm using KeePass XC.
[1108.60 --> 1109.48]  Good choice.
[1109.48 --> 1110.82]  What I like about it
[1110.82 --> 1112.18]  is that it's easy to back up
[1112.18 --> 1113.20]  because the whole database
[1113.20 --> 1114.46]  is just a single file.
[1115.02 --> 1115.86]  Currently sync it
[1115.86 --> 1116.74]  between my devices
[1116.74 --> 1118.60]  via self-hosted sync thing instance
[1118.60 --> 1119.96]  running on an ARM board
[1119.96 --> 1121.58]  in our laundry room.
[1122.06 --> 1122.86]  Laundry room servers.
[1123.00 --> 1123.36]  Very nice.
[1124.04 --> 1124.76]  That being said,
[1124.86 --> 1126.38]  this setup is a few years old
[1126.38 --> 1127.92]  and if I would start from scratch
[1127.92 --> 1129.68]  or if I had to share the password
[1129.68 --> 1130.42]  with other people,
[1130.58 --> 1132.16]  I'd definitely give Bitwarden a look.
[1132.72 --> 1133.74]  One thing I wonder though,
[1133.84 --> 1135.32]  when you host your passwords
[1135.32 --> 1136.98]  in a more complex application
[1136.98 --> 1137.74]  like Bitwarden,
[1138.04 --> 1139.82]  are you taking any extra measures
[1139.82 --> 1141.16]  to secure your servers?
[1141.80 --> 1142.82]  I suppose it's reasonable
[1142.82 --> 1144.42]  to trust the security
[1144.42 --> 1146.60]  of Bitwarden itself,
[1146.78 --> 1147.54]  but if an attacker
[1147.54 --> 1148.94]  would gain access to your server,
[1149.10 --> 1150.32]  would it be easier for them
[1150.32 --> 1151.04]  to do harm
[1151.04 --> 1152.58]  as compared to what you would
[1152.58 --> 1154.12]  just host an encrypted
[1154.12 --> 1155.78]  KeePass database file to?
[1156.40 --> 1157.76]  Thanks and keep on going.
[1157.96 --> 1158.14]  Hans.
[1158.54 --> 1159.34]  Well, I think it depends
[1159.34 --> 1161.38]  on how open your server is.
[1161.50 --> 1162.74]  If it's connected to the internet,
[1162.90 --> 1163.46]  you've got to assume
[1163.46 --> 1164.16]  at some point,
[1164.64 --> 1164.90]  you know,
[1165.02 --> 1166.54]  it's possible it might get
[1166.54 --> 1167.36]  compromised.
[1168.52 --> 1170.40]  But it speaks to a larger
[1170.40 --> 1172.60]  philosophy that I tend
[1172.60 --> 1173.42]  to subscribe to
[1173.42 --> 1174.24]  with this kind of stuff
[1174.24 --> 1176.00]  of don't be the tallest nail.
[1176.42 --> 1176.56]  You know,
[1176.74 --> 1178.54]  take some basic precautions.
[1178.74 --> 1180.10]  Have things like fail to ban
[1180.10 --> 1182.50]  installed on your SSH logins.
[1183.04 --> 1184.26]  Open as few ports
[1184.26 --> 1184.86]  in your firewall
[1184.86 --> 1185.92]  as you possibly can.
[1186.38 --> 1187.84]  Use something like WireGuard
[1187.84 --> 1188.60]  or TailScale
[1188.60 --> 1189.48]  or something like that
[1189.48 --> 1190.30]  to actually connect
[1190.30 --> 1191.40]  to the service in question
[1191.40 --> 1192.98]  so that all the data
[1192.98 --> 1194.28]  that travels between
[1194.28 --> 1195.28]  everything is encrypted.
[1195.28 --> 1196.72]  You know,
[1196.76 --> 1198.20]  and use things like SSH keys
[1198.20 --> 1199.10]  instead of passwords.
[1199.40 --> 1200.54]  Just those things alone
[1200.54 --> 1201.08]  are going to make you
[1201.08 --> 1202.26]  more secure than the average
[1202.26 --> 1203.30]  server administrator.
[1203.92 --> 1205.00]  Vault Warden is the new
[1205.00 --> 1205.92]  hotness these days.
[1206.04 --> 1207.70]  Bitwarden RS is the old name.
[1208.10 --> 1209.58]  And I do agree with everything
[1209.58 --> 1210.56]  you just said, Alex.
[1211.12 --> 1212.32]  Don't be the tallest nail.
[1212.42 --> 1213.00]  But also,
[1213.28 --> 1214.44]  consider the security
[1214.44 --> 1215.22]  of the box
[1215.22 --> 1215.80]  if possible.
[1215.90 --> 1216.94]  Limited internet access.
[1217.42 --> 1217.86]  And also,
[1218.08 --> 1218.82]  keep in mind,
[1219.38 --> 1220.76]  Bitwarden is using
[1220.76 --> 1222.22]  local encryption.
[1222.22 --> 1223.68]  So it encrypts
[1223.68 --> 1224.54]  and hashes your data
[1224.54 --> 1225.82]  on your local device
[1225.82 --> 1227.06]  before it sends it
[1227.06 --> 1227.92]  to the cloud server,
[1228.06 --> 1229.46]  even if it's their service
[1229.46 --> 1231.22]  or your self-hosted service.
[1231.54 --> 1232.42]  So that gives you
[1232.42 --> 1233.60]  some peace of mind
[1233.60 --> 1234.30]  knowing that the data
[1234.30 --> 1235.18]  that's at rest
[1235.18 --> 1235.66]  on the server
[1235.66 --> 1236.28]  is encrypted.
[1236.84 --> 1237.14]  Now, Alex,
[1237.18 --> 1237.68]  you mentioned
[1237.68 --> 1239.10]  being a shorter nail.
[1239.98 --> 1241.60]  Have either of you
[1241.60 --> 1242.84]  in all of your years
[1242.84 --> 1243.86]  encountered situations
[1243.86 --> 1244.96]  when you were
[1244.96 --> 1245.82]  one of the taller nails
[1245.82 --> 1246.84]  and ran into issues?
[1247.62 --> 1247.86]  You mean,
[1247.90 --> 1248.80]  like had a server compromised?
[1249.06 --> 1249.44]  Basically,
[1249.52 --> 1250.14]  that's what I'm asking.
[1250.14 --> 1250.58]  Yeah,
[1250.70 --> 1251.70]  it's never very exciting.
[1252.28 --> 1253.44]  It's usually like
[1253.44 --> 1254.12]  a server gets turned
[1254.12 --> 1255.50]  into an FTP box
[1255.50 --> 1257.44]  or somebody gets a process
[1257.44 --> 1258.20]  on your machine.
[1258.30 --> 1258.40]  I mean,
[1258.42 --> 1259.18]  I think I've had
[1259.18 --> 1260.32]  maybe a client or two
[1260.32 --> 1261.30]  that that's happened to.
[1262.16 --> 1263.38]  It's never anything
[1263.38 --> 1264.48]  more exciting
[1264.48 --> 1265.06]  than somebody trying
[1265.06 --> 1265.84]  to mine crypto
[1265.84 --> 1266.80]  or something these days.
[1267.86 --> 1268.98]  Can I admit something
[1268.98 --> 1269.62]  to you both?
[1269.92 --> 1270.38]  Oh, yeah.
[1270.62 --> 1271.64]  I used to run
[1271.64 --> 1273.32]  remote desktop
[1273.32 --> 1274.38]  open to the internet
[1274.38 --> 1275.36]  with the password
[1275.36 --> 1276.16]  22.
[1277.76 --> 1279.08]  You maniac.
[1279.08 --> 1280.88]  for like three years.
[1281.02 --> 1282.18]  And how'd that go, Alex?
[1283.42 --> 1283.82]  Well,
[1284.10 --> 1285.40]  it didn't end well,
[1285.82 --> 1286.06]  Brent.
[1286.32 --> 1287.54]  It didn't end well at all.
[1287.80 --> 1288.18]  No.
[1289.76 --> 1290.52]  What happened?
[1290.72 --> 1291.08]  Tell us.
[1292.08 --> 1293.42]  They decided
[1293.42 --> 1294.96]  to wipe my hard drives.
[1295.46 --> 1296.12]  Oh, no.
[1297.06 --> 1297.94]  Oh, that sucks.
[1298.06 --> 1298.58]  That sucks.
[1298.68 --> 1299.36]  I suppose maybe
[1299.36 --> 1300.00]  that's better than
[1300.00 --> 1301.20]  using it for something nefarious
[1301.20 --> 1301.92]  or maybe they did
[1301.92 --> 1302.64]  and then they wiped it
[1302.64 --> 1303.44]  so there's no track.
[1303.52 --> 1304.14]  So maybe they did
[1304.14 --> 1305.08]  do something nefarious.
[1305.26 --> 1306.08]  I have no idea.
[1306.08 --> 1306.50]  I mean,
[1306.52 --> 1307.04]  if your password
[1307.04 --> 1307.56]  is 22,
[1307.80 --> 1310.22]  maybe old Alex
[1310.22 --> 1311.14]  didn't know how to check.
[1313.06 --> 1313.42]  Yeah.
[1313.52 --> 1313.72]  I mean,
[1313.74 --> 1314.36]  back in the day,
[1314.50 --> 1316.54]  that was something
[1316.54 --> 1317.90]  you just didn't really think of
[1317.90 --> 1318.74]  way back in the day.
[1318.82 --> 1319.32]  Things were just
[1319.32 --> 1319.92]  on the internet.
[1320.10 --> 1322.14]  When I first got exposure
[1322.14 --> 1324.12]  to TCP IP networking,
[1324.68 --> 1325.82]  everything had a public
[1325.82 --> 1326.56]  internet address
[1326.56 --> 1327.32]  on the network.
[1327.72 --> 1328.84]  And it wasn't until
[1328.84 --> 1330.18]  sometime later
[1330.18 --> 1331.36]  that we had firewalls
[1331.36 --> 1332.12]  and NATs.
[1332.20 --> 1333.04]  And so for a short period
[1333.04 --> 1333.30]  of time,
[1333.34 --> 1333.90]  you could basically
[1333.90 --> 1334.80]  connect to everything.
[1336.30 --> 1337.58]  There was some crazy stuff
[1337.58 --> 1338.32]  we did back then.
[1338.88 --> 1339.58]  I didn't want to put you guys
[1339.58 --> 1339.98]  on the spot,
[1340.08 --> 1341.00]  but I would be curious
[1341.00 --> 1343.14]  about how to go about
[1343.14 --> 1344.30]  detecting some of this stuff,
[1344.54 --> 1344.76]  you know,
[1344.78 --> 1345.62]  even from a most
[1345.62 --> 1347.00]  very basic level.
[1347.68 --> 1348.00]  Hmm.
[1348.18 --> 1348.42]  Well,
[1348.48 --> 1348.82]  I mean,
[1348.82 --> 1349.24]  I'm sure Alex,
[1349.26 --> 1350.10]  you probably have a few ideas.
[1350.26 --> 1351.18]  My first couple
[1351.18 --> 1351.78]  that come to mind
[1351.78 --> 1353.40]  would be know what processes
[1353.40 --> 1353.94]  should be writing
[1353.94 --> 1354.58]  on your box,
[1354.72 --> 1355.60]  check your logs.
[1355.96 --> 1356.46]  I mean,
[1356.48 --> 1358.16]  almost every single time
[1358.16 --> 1359.70]  that a client machine
[1359.70 --> 1360.10]  or something
[1360.10 --> 1361.56]  was behaving poorly,
[1362.24 --> 1363.18]  I could almost immediately
[1363.18 --> 1364.14]  just suss it out
[1364.14 --> 1364.84]  by running top.
[1365.10 --> 1365.54]  I mean,
[1365.58 --> 1365.90]  really,
[1366.18 --> 1366.40]  because,
[1366.54 --> 1366.64]  you know,
[1366.70 --> 1367.52]  you know what that machine
[1367.52 --> 1368.40]  is supposed to be doing.
[1368.60 --> 1369.58]  And if there's some process
[1369.58 --> 1370.50]  going crazy on there
[1370.50 --> 1371.34]  that has nothing to do
[1371.34 --> 1372.28]  with the responsibilities
[1372.28 --> 1373.18]  of that box,
[1373.28 --> 1374.38]  you got a pretty good idea
[1374.38 --> 1374.98]  of what it is.
[1375.66 --> 1376.56]  And then you look
[1376.56 --> 1377.18]  at your logs,
[1377.26 --> 1377.42]  right?
[1377.42 --> 1378.96]  You look at the active users
[1378.96 --> 1380.42]  that are logged onto the system
[1380.42 --> 1381.96]  and you kind of start
[1381.96 --> 1382.62]  tracing it back.
[1382.70 --> 1383.22]  Usually you'll look
[1383.22 --> 1383.80]  at the process
[1383.80 --> 1384.32]  and there'll be like
[1384.32 --> 1386.08]  some weird path
[1386.08 --> 1386.64]  or URL
[1386.64 --> 1387.86]  for a process
[1387.86 --> 1388.72]  that looks normal,
[1388.82 --> 1389.92]  but it's in the wrong place
[1389.92 --> 1390.68]  or it's being run
[1390.68 --> 1391.56]  by the wrong user
[1391.56 --> 1392.92]  and you kind of track
[1392.92 --> 1393.54]  it back from there.
[1394.40 --> 1395.44]  Depends where
[1395.44 --> 1396.98]  your expertise lies.
[1397.48 --> 1399.12]  If you're a networking guy,
[1399.38 --> 1400.24]  you could use something
[1400.24 --> 1401.32]  like Snort,
[1401.84 --> 1402.64]  which is essentially
[1402.64 --> 1404.52]  a packet filter
[1404.52 --> 1405.78]  and it looks for certain
[1405.78 --> 1406.80]  patterns of packets.
[1406.96 --> 1407.12]  Yeah,
[1407.16 --> 1408.50]  or bandwidth charts as well.
[1408.58 --> 1408.72]  You know,
[1408.74 --> 1409.34]  that sometimes
[1409.34 --> 1410.32]  will be an indication
[1410.32 --> 1410.98]  something's up
[1410.98 --> 1411.40]  as you'll see
[1411.40 --> 1412.22]  your bandwidth usage
[1412.22 --> 1412.86]  spikes up.
[1414.14 --> 1415.14]  And would you guys say
[1415.14 --> 1416.02]  that containerizing
[1416.02 --> 1417.24]  some of your services
[1417.24 --> 1418.14]  is a way to
[1418.14 --> 1419.06]  help this situation?
[1419.06 --> 1421.56]  No.
[1421.94 --> 1422.30]  No.
[1424.72 --> 1425.08]  No,
[1425.18 --> 1425.38]  I mean,
[1425.40 --> 1425.62]  really,
[1425.68 --> 1425.96]  in a way,
[1426.02 --> 1426.70]  it makes it worse.
[1426.84 --> 1427.56]  I think it makes it worse
[1427.56 --> 1428.74]  because there's more processes
[1428.74 --> 1429.80]  and more things going on
[1429.80 --> 1430.96]  on a box in some cases.
[1431.48 --> 1432.18]  But you do have
[1432.18 --> 1432.76]  better security
[1432.76 --> 1433.58]  in terms of networking
[1433.58 --> 1434.22]  control
[1434.22 --> 1435.70]  and process isolation
[1435.70 --> 1436.84]  and the ability
[1436.84 --> 1437.68]  to just destroy
[1437.68 --> 1438.20]  a container
[1438.20 --> 1439.00]  and recreate it
[1439.00 --> 1439.46]  if something did
[1439.46 --> 1439.88]  go sideways.
[1440.02 --> 1440.36]  So it's,
[1440.68 --> 1440.96]  I mean,
[1440.96 --> 1441.40]  it's a mix.
[1441.48 --> 1442.28]  I think it's good and bad.
[1442.40 --> 1442.74]  But I'm sure,
[1442.82 --> 1442.96]  Alex,
[1443.00 --> 1443.58]  you must have thoughts.
[1443.66 --> 1444.24]  You must have thoughts.
[1444.58 --> 1444.70]  Well,
[1444.88 --> 1445.52]  containers good,
[1445.60 --> 1446.40]  everything else bad,
[1446.52 --> 1446.76]  right?
[1446.76 --> 1447.52]  That's my viewpoint.
[1447.52 --> 1451.56]  But I think containers
[1451.56 --> 1452.66]  are better in this situation
[1452.66 --> 1453.40]  because let's say
[1453.40 --> 1454.82]  you've got an NGINX web server
[1454.82 --> 1456.44]  listening with your
[1456.44 --> 1458.46]  vault warden behind it
[1458.46 --> 1459.88]  or whatever the web server is
[1459.88 --> 1461.18]  that's exposing your passwords
[1461.18 --> 1462.38]  to you.
[1462.90 --> 1464.46]  If somebody was to compromise
[1464.46 --> 1466.46]  something in that code
[1466.46 --> 1468.04]  and do a buffer overflow
[1468.04 --> 1468.76]  or do something
[1468.76 --> 1469.76]  that meant they could get
[1469.76 --> 1470.56]  something out of memory
[1470.56 --> 1471.30]  that they shouldn't
[1471.30 --> 1473.58]  and extrapolate some data
[1473.58 --> 1474.94]  that they shouldn't get,
[1474.94 --> 1476.98]  the blast radius of that
[1476.98 --> 1477.80]  is going to be limited
[1477.80 --> 1478.76]  to the scope
[1478.76 --> 1480.32]  that that container
[1480.32 --> 1481.48]  has access to.
[1482.22 --> 1483.72]  And so running things
[1483.72 --> 1484.22]  in a container
[1484.22 --> 1485.20]  is more secure
[1485.20 --> 1486.74]  simply by virtue
[1486.74 --> 1487.26]  of the fact
[1487.26 --> 1488.46]  that you are scoping
[1488.46 --> 1489.48]  what that container
[1489.48 --> 1490.44]  has access to
[1490.44 --> 1491.60]  on the host system.
[1492.36 --> 1492.38]  Yeah,
[1492.46 --> 1492.68]  I mean,
[1492.68 --> 1493.32]  it will have access
[1493.32 --> 1494.24]  to any of the data
[1494.24 --> 1495.02]  that the container
[1495.02 --> 1495.78]  has access to
[1495.78 --> 1496.92]  which is likely
[1496.92 --> 1497.64]  important data
[1497.64 --> 1498.72]  but it's contained
[1498.72 --> 1499.84]  to that region.
[1500.06 --> 1500.94]  That's inherently more safe
[1500.94 --> 1501.84]  than say running Apache
[1501.84 --> 1502.92]  or NGINX on a box
[1502.92 --> 1504.02]  and you pop Apache
[1504.02 --> 1505.20]  and now you've got
[1505.20 --> 1506.08]  access to anything
[1506.08 --> 1506.98]  on that host
[1506.98 --> 1508.12]  that Apache had access to
[1508.12 --> 1509.18]  which if you're lucky
[1509.18 --> 1509.80]  is not much
[1509.80 --> 1511.22]  but sometimes
[1511.22 --> 1511.74]  is way more
[1511.74 --> 1512.30]  than it should be.
[1512.74 --> 1513.56]  So yeah,
[1514.40 --> 1516.24]  it's going to be different
[1516.24 --> 1517.04]  every time too.
[1517.30 --> 1519.08]  There's not a one-size-fits-all solution.
[1519.24 --> 1520.50]  It's trying to make sure
[1520.50 --> 1521.18]  you're secure
[1521.18 --> 1522.24]  and monitoring
[1522.24 --> 1523.74]  in multiple locations.
[1524.96 --> 1526.30]  We got a lot of email
[1526.30 --> 1527.98]  about people's Wi-Fi systems.
[1528.10 --> 1528.72]  We got some people
[1528.72 --> 1529.80]  who love mesh setups,
[1530.26 --> 1531.24]  some people who hate
[1531.24 --> 1532.16]  mesh setups
[1532.16 --> 1533.62]  but we got one email
[1533.62 --> 1534.56]  in about a
[1534.56 --> 1536.54]  free mesh wireless solution.
[1536.78 --> 1537.16]  It's at
[1537.16 --> 1538.74]  freemeshwireless.com.
[1539.14 --> 1540.12]  It's an open source package
[1540.12 --> 1541.18]  that you load
[1541.18 --> 1541.80]  onto hardware
[1541.80 --> 1543.54]  and then we got some people
[1543.54 --> 1544.34]  that said don't do it.
[1544.44 --> 1546.22]  Just deploy multiple APs.
[1546.36 --> 1547.34]  So I'm still collecting
[1547.34 --> 1548.20]  information
[1548.20 --> 1549.00]  and taking it all in
[1549.00 --> 1550.02]  and I got a few devices
[1550.02 --> 1550.90]  to research too
[1550.90 --> 1552.10]  so I wanted to say
[1552.10 --> 1552.76]  thank you to everybody
[1552.76 --> 1553.80]  who sent in suggestions
[1553.80 --> 1555.12]  for different Wi-Fi setups.
[1555.66 --> 1555.96]  Wow,
[1556.54 --> 1557.50]  there's a lot out there
[1557.50 --> 1558.40]  including some of you
[1558.40 --> 1558.72]  who said,
[1558.78 --> 1559.08]  you know what,
[1559.10 --> 1560.02]  just stick with Unify.
[1560.20 --> 1560.64]  It's fine.
[1560.96 --> 1561.40]  It's fine.
[1561.40 --> 1562.34]  Well, okay,
[1562.34 --> 1562.84]  just one guy.
[1564.52 --> 1565.46]  And several folks,
[1565.58 --> 1565.78]  Brent,
[1565.86 --> 1566.76]  were happy with your
[1566.76 --> 1567.82]  recommendation of checking
[1567.82 --> 1568.72]  out Microtik.
[1568.98 --> 1569.90]  It's almost like I know
[1569.90 --> 1570.30]  something.
[1572.92 --> 1574.14]  At the meetup in Denver,
[1574.32 --> 1575.54]  several of you let me know
[1575.54 --> 1577.64]  that you are massive fans
[1577.64 --> 1579.02]  of cloudfree.shop
[1579.02 --> 1580.00]  and they are sponsoring
[1580.00 --> 1580.82]  today's episode.
[1581.28 --> 1582.28]  Use the coupon code
[1582.28 --> 1583.04]  self-hosted
[1583.04 --> 1584.16]  and get a dollar off
[1584.16 --> 1585.14]  one of their new version
[1585.14 --> 1586.36]  two smart plugs
[1586.36 --> 1587.32]  with energy monitoring
[1587.32 --> 1587.88]  built in.
[1587.88 --> 1589.10]  Also,
[1589.54 --> 1590.50]  those of you in the UK
[1590.50 --> 1591.54]  who have let me know
[1591.54 --> 1592.52]  that you wish
[1592.52 --> 1593.48]  that cloudfree.shop
[1593.48 --> 1594.32]  shipped to the UK,
[1594.66 --> 1594.82]  well,
[1594.98 --> 1595.80]  good news!
[1596.56 --> 1597.60]  Mylocalbytes.com
[1597.60 --> 1598.74]  have launched in the UK
[1598.74 --> 1600.60]  offering a very similar thing.
[1601.00 --> 1602.10]  You can use the coupon code
[1602.10 --> 1602.68]  self-hosted
[1602.68 --> 1604.04]  at both cloudfree.shop
[1604.04 --> 1605.74]  and mylocalbytes.com
[1605.74 --> 1607.04]  to get a dollar
[1607.04 --> 1607.70]  or a pound
[1607.70 --> 1609.46]  off each smart plug.
[1609.86 --> 1610.62]  Both of these stores
[1610.62 --> 1611.40]  are owned
[1611.40 --> 1612.08]  and operated
[1612.08 --> 1613.64]  by a couple of our listeners,
[1613.64 --> 1614.96]  so head over there,
[1615.06 --> 1615.80]  support the community
[1615.80 --> 1617.00]  and check out
[1617.00 --> 1618.02]  their cool stuff.
[1619.80 --> 1621.28]  We had a lot of emails
[1621.28 --> 1623.36]  in regards to de-googling
[1623.36 --> 1625.02]  and it really ran
[1625.02 --> 1625.96]  the whole spectrum.
[1626.12 --> 1626.52]  We're going to try
[1626.52 --> 1628.38]  to get to some of them,
[1628.88 --> 1629.76]  but legitimately,
[1630.04 --> 1630.16]  Brett,
[1630.20 --> 1630.84]  you saw the list.
[1630.92 --> 1631.56]  There's just no way
[1631.56 --> 1632.00]  we could read
[1632.00 --> 1632.64]  all those emails.
[1633.06 --> 1633.24]  Yeah,
[1633.30 --> 1633.86]  you gave me
[1633.86 --> 1634.82]  a little sneak peek
[1634.82 --> 1635.72]  at just the number
[1635.72 --> 1637.06]  of the sheer number of emails.
[1637.08 --> 1637.50]  I just scrolled
[1637.50 --> 1638.16]  through the list.
[1638.44 --> 1638.46]  Oh,
[1638.58 --> 1639.38]  we did our best,
[1639.64 --> 1640.06]  but we've...
[1640.06 --> 1640.88]  It's a lot of email.
[1641.36 --> 1641.62]  Yeah,
[1642.36 --> 1643.10]  but Dustin was one
[1643.10 --> 1644.40]  of the first to write in
[1644.40 --> 1645.40]  and Dustin was at
[1645.40 --> 1646.00]  the Boise meetup
[1646.00 --> 1646.36]  with us,
[1646.44 --> 1646.60]  Brent.
[1647.16 --> 1647.56]  He says,
[1647.62 --> 1648.60]  on today's self-hosted,
[1648.62 --> 1649.16]  you guys talked
[1649.16 --> 1649.98]  about de-googling.
[1650.44 --> 1651.38]  This is my journey
[1651.38 --> 1651.94]  and it has been
[1651.94 --> 1652.70]  for two years
[1652.70 --> 1653.12]  and I'd say I'm
[1653.12 --> 1654.24]  about 90%
[1654.24 --> 1655.44]  of the way there.
[1655.92 --> 1656.48]  Dustin goes on
[1656.48 --> 1656.64]  to say,
[1656.72 --> 1657.28]  this includes
[1657.28 --> 1658.18]  replacing G Suite
[1658.18 --> 1658.94]  for my podcast
[1658.94 --> 1659.86]  and I've also gone
[1659.86 --> 1660.46]  with the model
[1660.46 --> 1661.52]  of self-hosting
[1661.52 --> 1662.24]  when it makes sense.
[1662.68 --> 1663.50]  So here's what he's done.
[1663.60 --> 1664.00]  For mail,
[1664.12 --> 1664.48]  contacts,
[1664.56 --> 1665.14]  and calendar,
[1665.56 --> 1666.06]  he switched
[1666.06 --> 1666.78]  from G Suite
[1666.78 --> 1667.68]  to Fastmail.
[1668.08 --> 1669.48]  For notes and docs,
[1669.54 --> 1670.70]  he's using Joplin,
[1671.30 --> 1672.12]  using Nextcloud
[1672.12 --> 1672.70]  to sync it,
[1673.10 --> 1674.30]  for photo sync,
[1674.36 --> 1675.26]  he's using Nextcloud.
[1675.62 --> 1676.28]  For his phone,
[1676.36 --> 1676.78]  he's gone with
[1676.78 --> 1677.96]  the iPhone SE 2020,
[1678.26 --> 1678.80]  so he's not dealing
[1678.80 --> 1679.44]  with Google there.
[1679.90 --> 1680.44]  For DNS,
[1680.72 --> 1681.78]  he's using NextDNS.
[1681.86 --> 1682.50]  We got another vote
[1682.50 --> 1683.56]  for NextDNS as well.
[1684.10 --> 1684.98]  For maps,
[1685.34 --> 1686.32]  he's using a combination
[1686.32 --> 1687.36]  of Apple Maps
[1687.36 --> 1689.02]  and the OpenStreetMaps
[1689.02 --> 1690.46]  app on the App Store.
[1690.98 --> 1691.82]  And for the browser,
[1691.98 --> 1692.50]  he's sticking with
[1692.50 --> 1693.56]  Firefox and Safari.
[1694.28 --> 1695.30]  And for his Chromebook,
[1695.40 --> 1695.52]  well,
[1695.54 --> 1696.32]  he's replaced that
[1696.32 --> 1698.04]  with the ThinkPad X260
[1698.04 --> 1698.62]  with Arch
[1698.62 --> 1699.88]  and now Fedora on there.
[1700.10 --> 1700.96]  He's still working
[1700.96 --> 1701.74]  on the home assistance.
[1701.74 --> 1702.54]  He's going to maybe
[1702.54 --> 1703.60]  consider the HomePods
[1703.60 --> 1705.26]  and look at Mycroft.
[1705.58 --> 1705.92]  He says,
[1706.00 --> 1706.56]  Google Photos
[1706.56 --> 1707.20]  has been working great
[1707.20 --> 1708.04]  for my wife,
[1708.30 --> 1709.70]  but I'm not using it.
[1710.12 --> 1711.04]  And he's using
[1711.04 --> 1711.68]  FreeTube
[1711.68 --> 1713.50]  to bypass YouTube,
[1713.50 --> 1714.36]  but it has been
[1714.36 --> 1715.10]  a bit of a challenge,
[1715.18 --> 1715.58]  I suspect.
[1716.28 --> 1717.40]  Some good tips there,
[1717.48 --> 1719.04]  although Fastmail
[1719.04 --> 1720.76]  isn't self-hosting.
[1720.84 --> 1721.34]  It is,
[1721.54 --> 1721.80]  you know,
[1721.80 --> 1722.88]  having somebody else host it.
[1722.90 --> 1723.28]  But if you're going
[1723.28 --> 1724.08]  to have somebody host something,
[1724.20 --> 1725.54]  email's a good one to do.
[1726.22 --> 1727.32]  Don't really do.
[1727.66 --> 1728.22]  Don't do.
[1728.50 --> 1729.38]  Don't do email.
[1730.48 --> 1731.10]  What I noticed
[1731.10 --> 1731.78]  from that feedback
[1731.78 --> 1732.82]  is that it took him,
[1733.44 --> 1733.66]  well,
[1733.98 --> 1735.06]  he's on a two-year journey.
[1735.50 --> 1735.98]  And so,
[1736.24 --> 1736.52]  gentlemen,
[1736.86 --> 1738.42]  what does that tell you
[1738.42 --> 1739.62]  about what you've just got on?
[1739.86 --> 1741.50]  That Alex has really,
[1741.60 --> 1742.34]  really gotten us
[1742.34 --> 1742.82]  into something.
[1742.94 --> 1743.58]  What have I done?
[1744.08 --> 1745.42]  I've opened Pandora's box
[1745.42 --> 1745.66]  here,
[1745.74 --> 1746.02]  aren't I?
[1747.32 --> 1747.76]  Oh,
[1747.76 --> 1748.36]  man.
[1749.48 --> 1750.06]  All right.
[1750.16 --> 1750.36]  So,
[1750.46 --> 1751.18]  Carson and others
[1751.18 --> 1752.52]  wrote in about maps.
[1752.68 --> 1753.24]  Carson says
[1753.24 --> 1754.52]  he settled on HereMaps
[1754.52 --> 1755.34]  as a replacement,
[1755.54 --> 1756.80]  wego.here.com.
[1756.80 --> 1758.22]  A lot of people wrote in
[1758.22 --> 1759.16]  about open street maps.
[1759.32 --> 1759.42]  Brent,
[1759.48 --> 1760.40]  that's what you use?
[1760.76 --> 1760.94]  Yeah,
[1761.02 --> 1762.50]  that's what I have been using
[1762.50 --> 1763.58]  until all these suggestions
[1763.58 --> 1764.18]  came in.
[1764.40 --> 1765.16]  And I,
[1765.78 --> 1766.10]  well,
[1766.76 --> 1767.76]  maybe I'll keep that
[1767.76 --> 1768.52]  until we talk about
[1768.52 --> 1769.60]  the maps a little bit more.
[1769.78 --> 1769.90]  Well,
[1769.92 --> 1770.56]  I want to talk about it
[1770.56 --> 1771.22]  right now because
[1771.22 --> 1772.52]  that's the route
[1772.52 --> 1773.34]  I decided to go
[1773.34 --> 1774.00]  during a
[1774.00 --> 1775.50]  freaking road trip.
[1775.76 --> 1776.96]  And I even really
[1776.96 --> 1778.12]  briefly tried Waze,
[1778.20 --> 1778.62]  even though I know
[1778.62 --> 1779.18]  it's owned by Google,
[1779.22 --> 1779.76]  I just wanted to
[1779.76 --> 1780.66]  just do a comparison.
[1781.04 --> 1781.92]  And Waze actually
[1781.92 --> 1782.98]  screwed us up the worst
[1782.98 --> 1783.88]  out of all of them
[1783.88 --> 1785.12]  during the middle
[1785.12 --> 1786.26]  of Denver rush hour.
[1786.26 --> 1787.00]  It had me get off
[1787.00 --> 1787.46]  the highway
[1787.46 --> 1788.76]  to bypass the traffic.
[1789.18 --> 1789.88]  And then I got off
[1789.88 --> 1790.18]  the highway
[1790.18 --> 1790.74]  and I was stuck
[1790.74 --> 1791.38]  in more traffic.
[1791.54 --> 1792.00]  And then it did
[1792.00 --> 1792.70]  a quick update
[1792.70 --> 1793.04]  and it said,
[1793.20 --> 1793.76]  get on the highway.
[1794.28 --> 1794.36]  Yeah,
[1794.42 --> 1795.18]  it felt to me
[1795.18 --> 1796.28]  like an attempt
[1796.28 --> 1797.58]  at a Dukes of Hazzard
[1797.58 --> 1799.04]  style walk around
[1799.04 --> 1799.70]  the traffic,
[1800.04 --> 1801.26]  but it didn't work
[1801.26 --> 1802.04]  out too well for us.
[1802.88 --> 1803.28]  Oh,
[1803.52 --> 1803.88]  goodness.
[1804.30 --> 1804.80]  So I know
[1804.80 --> 1805.24]  a lot of you
[1805.24 --> 1806.02]  wrote in with
[1806.02 --> 1807.26]  the apps that you love
[1807.26 --> 1808.22]  and I tried them
[1808.22 --> 1809.64]  and boy,
[1809.70 --> 1810.30]  do they stink.
[1810.44 --> 1811.08]  Magic Earth
[1811.08 --> 1812.16]  was one that I liked
[1812.16 --> 1813.82]  and that uses
[1813.82 --> 1814.64]  open street maps
[1814.64 --> 1816.04]  with a proprietary GUI
[1816.04 --> 1816.70]  on top,
[1816.88 --> 1817.68]  Magic Earth,
[1818.02 --> 1818.40]  have a link
[1818.40 --> 1819.22]  in the show notes.
[1820.12 --> 1822.28]  But they all have
[1822.28 --> 1823.52]  one critical flaw.
[1823.70 --> 1824.44]  Even Apple Maps
[1824.44 --> 1825.44]  has this critical flaw
[1825.44 --> 1826.62]  and it's search.
[1827.88 --> 1828.68]  For example,
[1828.78 --> 1829.80]  I'm here in Colorado Springs
[1829.80 --> 1830.82]  and I searched
[1830.82 --> 1831.66]  for Pikes Peak,
[1831.78 --> 1833.52]  which is a very popular
[1833.52 --> 1834.38]  tourist destination.
[1835.56 --> 1836.82]  Apple Maps sent me
[1836.82 --> 1838.36]  in the wrong direction.
[1838.46 --> 1838.80]  They sent me
[1838.80 --> 1839.80]  to some like business
[1839.80 --> 1840.42]  that was named
[1840.42 --> 1841.08]  Pikes Peak
[1841.08 --> 1841.84]  that was like
[1841.84 --> 1842.90]  10 miles
[1842.90 --> 1843.66]  in the wrong direction,
[1843.96 --> 1845.42]  literally the opposite direction.
[1846.86 --> 1848.20]  The Magic Earth
[1848.20 --> 1849.40]  using open street maps
[1849.40 --> 1850.50]  wanted to send me
[1850.50 --> 1851.22]  to a location
[1851.22 --> 1852.78]  5,200 miles away
[1852.78 --> 1853.88]  from my current location.
[1854.44 --> 1855.64]  I was 25,
[1855.84 --> 1856.50]  30 minutes away
[1856.50 --> 1857.08]  when I started
[1857.08 --> 1857.90]  from Pikes Peak
[1857.90 --> 1858.78]  and after I was done
[1858.78 --> 1859.22]  trying to use
[1859.22 --> 1860.02]  these other nav apps,
[1860.14 --> 1861.42]  I ended up an hour away
[1861.42 --> 1863.24]  and I was really bad.
[1864.00 --> 1864.44]  Eventually,
[1864.56 --> 1865.00]  what happened
[1865.00 --> 1866.00]  is my wife
[1866.00 --> 1866.56]  looked it up
[1866.56 --> 1867.20]  on her phone
[1867.20 --> 1867.98]  on Google Maps
[1867.98 --> 1870.08]  and got an address
[1870.08 --> 1871.44]  and then telegrammed it to me
[1871.44 --> 1872.22]  and then I put that
[1872.22 --> 1873.28]  into Apple Maps
[1873.28 --> 1875.48]  and manually did it that way.
[1875.48 --> 1875.94]  You're an animal.
[1876.78 --> 1877.16]  Yeah,
[1877.20 --> 1877.60]  it was interesting
[1877.60 --> 1879.12]  because she kept using
[1879.12 --> 1880.12]  Google Maps
[1880.12 --> 1880.88]  during this.
[1881.30 --> 1882.12]  Anytime I drove
[1882.12 --> 1882.90]  or anytime I was looking
[1882.90 --> 1883.50]  anything up
[1883.50 --> 1883.88]  or looking,
[1884.00 --> 1885.28]  I used anything
[1885.28 --> 1885.98]  but Google Maps
[1885.98 --> 1886.48]  and she stuck
[1886.48 --> 1886.96]  with Google Maps
[1886.96 --> 1887.38]  so I was always
[1887.38 --> 1888.20]  comparing the two
[1888.20 --> 1890.14]  and they clearly
[1890.14 --> 1891.64]  have the superior
[1891.64 --> 1894.02]  search.
[1894.72 --> 1895.16]  However,
[1896.32 --> 1897.00]  Apple Maps
[1897.00 --> 1897.86]  surprised me
[1897.86 --> 1898.34]  and I looked
[1898.34 --> 1899.10]  into the privacy
[1899.10 --> 1899.82]  and security
[1899.82 --> 1900.54]  of Apple Maps
[1900.54 --> 1901.24]  because that was
[1901.24 --> 1901.84]  really what part
[1901.84 --> 1902.36]  of this was about
[1902.36 --> 1903.38]  was reducing
[1903.38 --> 1904.20]  my cloud footprint
[1904.20 --> 1904.70]  with this.
[1904.98 --> 1906.28]  The thing I liked
[1906.28 --> 1906.94]  about Apple Maps
[1906.94 --> 1907.54]  is surprisingly
[1907.54 --> 1908.04]  you don't even
[1908.04 --> 1908.62]  have to be signed
[1908.62 --> 1909.80]  into any Apple ID
[1909.80 --> 1910.30]  or iCloud
[1910.30 --> 1910.94]  to use it.
[1911.52 --> 1911.92]  The data
[1911.92 --> 1912.86]  that they do collect
[1912.86 --> 1913.84]  is associated
[1913.84 --> 1914.60]  with a randomly
[1914.60 --> 1915.68]  generated identifier.
[1915.96 --> 1916.46]  They reset
[1916.46 --> 1917.66]  like every few minutes
[1917.66 --> 1919.06]  and it is not tied
[1919.06 --> 1919.68]  to your Apple ID.
[1920.42 --> 1921.34]  They convert
[1921.34 --> 1922.64]  precise locations
[1922.64 --> 1924.22]  into less exact locations
[1924.22 --> 1925.34]  before they store them
[1925.34 --> 1926.46]  and then they apply
[1926.46 --> 1927.34]  that to your current
[1927.34 --> 1928.02]  device location
[1928.02 --> 1928.58]  information
[1928.58 --> 1929.16]  and origin
[1929.16 --> 1930.68]  within 24 hours
[1930.68 --> 1933.24]  and any of the
[1933.24 --> 1934.32]  personalized features
[1934.32 --> 1935.56]  like where your car
[1935.56 --> 1936.08]  is parked
[1936.08 --> 1937.26]  or suggested
[1937.26 --> 1938.54]  departure times
[1938.54 --> 1940.52]  your favorite locations
[1940.52 --> 1942.06]  any of that kind
[1942.06 --> 1942.36]  of stuff
[1942.36 --> 1943.04]  that you generate
[1943.04 --> 1944.18]  it's all stored
[1944.18 --> 1944.70]  on device.
[1944.82 --> 1945.52]  They don't send it up
[1945.52 --> 1946.14]  to the Apple servers
[1946.14 --> 1946.42]  at all.
[1947.24 --> 1947.66]  It seems to me
[1947.66 --> 1948.28]  the way they've
[1948.28 --> 1949.04]  defined how
[1949.04 --> 1950.00]  Apple Maps works
[1950.00 --> 1951.24]  is sort of
[1951.24 --> 1951.90]  their privacy
[1951.90 --> 1952.96]  first approach
[1952.96 --> 1954.08]  that they've been
[1954.08 --> 1955.00]  sharing
[1955.00 --> 1956.26]  throughout the years.
[1956.50 --> 1956.66]  Yeah.
[1956.78 --> 1957.40]  I'm not going to say
[1957.40 --> 1958.02]  it's perfect.
[1958.26 --> 1958.98]  But it feels like
[1958.98 --> 1960.00]  they got most of it right
[1960.00 --> 1961.54]  considering all of the
[1961.54 --> 1962.76]  sort of technical stuff
[1962.76 --> 1963.66]  that has to happen
[1963.66 --> 1964.60]  to get you around
[1964.60 --> 1965.58]  on a Maps app.
[1965.76 --> 1967.82]  Or another way
[1967.82 --> 1969.18]  is it feels like
[1969.18 --> 1970.04]  they designed a product
[1970.04 --> 1971.40]  to say screw you
[1971.40 --> 1971.82]  to Google
[1971.82 --> 1972.84]  on data collection
[1972.84 --> 1973.56]  and stuff like that.
[1973.62 --> 1974.14]  And did it work?
[1974.54 --> 1974.76]  Well,
[1974.94 --> 1976.26]  the display
[1976.26 --> 1977.28]  is probably the best.
[1977.36 --> 1977.82]  The other thing
[1977.82 --> 1978.18]  that I found
[1978.18 --> 1979.20]  surprisingly good
[1979.20 --> 1981.48]  is the voice routing.
[1981.82 --> 1983.42]  It has really good
[1983.42 --> 1983.82]  clear,
[1983.98 --> 1984.94]  like very clear
[1984.94 --> 1985.58]  about which lane
[1985.58 --> 1986.02]  to be in,
[1986.10 --> 1986.98]  which isn't too uncommon.
[1987.72 --> 1989.32]  And it's very clear
[1989.32 --> 1990.44]  about intersections.
[1990.78 --> 1992.10]  And here in the
[1992.10 --> 1993.28]  Colorado-Denver area,
[1993.46 --> 1994.78]  they stack the intersections.
[1995.16 --> 1996.46]  So you drive
[1996.46 --> 1997.12]  through an intersection
[1997.12 --> 1998.56]  and then three
[1998.56 --> 1999.44]  or four car lengths
[1999.44 --> 1999.78]  later,
[1999.88 --> 2001.24]  there is another intersection.
[2001.88 --> 2002.54]  And so when you look
[2002.54 --> 2003.14]  on a map,
[2003.26 --> 2004.04]  you're not really sure
[2004.04 --> 2004.72]  like what light
[2004.72 --> 2005.36]  to turn on.
[2005.52 --> 2006.96]  And the voice prompt
[2006.96 --> 2007.70]  is very clear.
[2007.80 --> 2008.26]  It'll say,
[2008.26 --> 2009.96]  go through this light
[2009.96 --> 2011.06]  and at the next light,
[2011.52 --> 2012.12]  take a left,
[2012.38 --> 2013.38]  be in the middle lane.
[2014.06 --> 2014.88]  And when you're,
[2014.88 --> 2015.50]  when you're new
[2015.50 --> 2016.40]  to an area
[2016.40 --> 2017.08]  and it's dark
[2017.08 --> 2018.18]  and you're coming up
[2018.18 --> 2018.96]  on two intersections
[2018.96 --> 2019.40]  and you know
[2019.40 --> 2020.42]  you've got a left turn
[2020.42 --> 2021.50]  or a right turn,
[2021.64 --> 2022.66]  that kind of clarity
[2022.66 --> 2024.52]  just makes it low stress.
[2024.62 --> 2025.28]  Then additionally,
[2025.52 --> 2026.76]  they tie in with the watch
[2026.76 --> 2027.78]  so it taps your arm
[2027.78 --> 2028.92]  when you need to turn.
[2029.36 --> 2030.62]  And when you were driving,
[2031.00 --> 2031.68]  I was able to just
[2031.68 --> 2032.36]  look at my watch
[2032.36 --> 2032.78]  and tell you
[2032.78 --> 2033.62]  what the next turn is.
[2033.84 --> 2033.92]  Yeah,
[2033.96 --> 2034.64]  that was really handy.
[2034.92 --> 2036.36]  I will admit that
[2036.36 --> 2037.56]  halfway through the trip,
[2037.56 --> 2038.46]  I kind of gave up
[2038.46 --> 2039.12]  on my phone
[2039.12 --> 2040.30]  and my map app
[2040.30 --> 2040.74]  because,
[2041.08 --> 2041.18]  well,
[2041.22 --> 2041.82]  we were doing this,
[2041.86 --> 2042.52]  this experiment
[2042.52 --> 2044.84]  and my methods
[2044.84 --> 2045.32]  were failing.
[2045.70 --> 2047.30]  So you were in the nav seat
[2047.30 --> 2048.42]  and you were helping me out
[2048.42 --> 2049.22]  and that actually
[2049.22 --> 2049.92]  worked out all right.
[2050.16 --> 2050.54]  I think I'm going
[2050.54 --> 2051.14]  to stick with it.
[2051.34 --> 2052.14]  I don't think I'm after the,
[2052.26 --> 2052.46]  I mean,
[2052.48 --> 2053.38]  I said I'd do it for two weeks
[2053.38 --> 2053.82]  and I think I'm going
[2053.82 --> 2054.48]  to stick with it.
[2055.20 --> 2055.86]  I'll let my,
[2055.98 --> 2056.14]  you know,
[2056.18 --> 2056.90]  my wife will still have
[2056.90 --> 2057.80]  Google Maps as a backup,
[2058.08 --> 2058.76]  but for me,
[2059.16 --> 2060.22]  I'm uninstalling Google Maps
[2060.22 --> 2060.64]  off the phone.
[2061.26 --> 2061.58]  Wow.
[2061.80 --> 2061.92]  Yeah.
[2061.92 --> 2063.14]  So that's quite a success.
[2063.34 --> 2063.52]  Yeah.
[2063.58 --> 2064.92]  It's not open street maps,
[2065.14 --> 2066.12]  although I am playing
[2066.12 --> 2066.74]  with those still
[2066.74 --> 2067.58]  and I do really like
[2067.58 --> 2068.28]  the way Magic Earth
[2068.28 --> 2069.18]  displays things.
[2069.76 --> 2070.96]  So for some circumstances,
[2070.96 --> 2071.68]  like if I already know
[2071.68 --> 2072.30]  the address
[2072.30 --> 2073.28]  and I'm not searching
[2073.28 --> 2073.92]  up something,
[2074.66 --> 2075.88]  they may have a place still.
[2076.24 --> 2077.62]  But I,
[2077.70 --> 2078.28]  I was,
[2078.46 --> 2079.42]  I was pretty impressed.
[2080.20 --> 2080.76]  You know,
[2080.82 --> 2081.76]  if you only could have
[2081.76 --> 2082.24]  one app
[2082.24 --> 2083.82]  and you didn't care
[2083.82 --> 2084.80]  about Google tracking you,
[2085.20 --> 2086.26]  I'd probably still suggest
[2086.26 --> 2086.98]  you use Google Maps.
[2087.84 --> 2088.40]  You know,
[2088.52 --> 2088.78]  I,
[2088.96 --> 2089.40]  for the trip,
[2089.48 --> 2091.18]  used the same app
[2091.18 --> 2091.86]  that I've been using
[2091.86 --> 2093.24]  for probably the last two years
[2093.24 --> 2094.36]  since I've tried this
[2094.36 --> 2095.58]  de-googling a while ago,
[2096.06 --> 2098.06]  mostly successfully.
[2098.58 --> 2100.14]  And so I'm on Android
[2100.14 --> 2100.92]  and I've been using
[2100.92 --> 2102.38]  OpenStreetMap,
[2102.46 --> 2103.44]  the OSM,
[2103.60 --> 2104.46]  and plus.
[2105.64 --> 2106.32]  There are things
[2106.32 --> 2106.94]  I love about it
[2106.94 --> 2107.88]  and things I hate about it.
[2108.32 --> 2109.14]  The one thing,
[2109.22 --> 2110.20]  you mentioned search.
[2110.72 --> 2112.22]  I find it's great
[2112.22 --> 2113.28]  if you know
[2113.28 --> 2114.00]  approximately
[2114.00 --> 2114.84]  where you want to go.
[2115.00 --> 2115.70]  If you're trying to find
[2115.70 --> 2116.70]  an exact business
[2116.70 --> 2117.82]  or even
[2117.82 --> 2119.06]  an exact address
[2119.06 --> 2120.46]  on a popular street,
[2120.92 --> 2122.86]  it's not necessarily
[2122.86 --> 2123.46]  going to have it.
[2123.52 --> 2124.26]  It might have some
[2124.26 --> 2125.16]  of the street numbers,
[2125.60 --> 2126.76]  but certainly not all of them.
[2126.82 --> 2127.68]  I found that to be
[2127.68 --> 2128.52]  a little bit frustrating,
[2128.80 --> 2129.02]  but
[2129.02 --> 2131.40]  it gets me there.
[2132.06 --> 2132.88]  I will say
[2132.88 --> 2133.84]  90% of the time
[2133.84 --> 2134.52]  it works for me,
[2134.60 --> 2135.82]  but I like getting lost
[2135.82 --> 2136.60]  in new cities,
[2136.76 --> 2137.58]  so maybe that's
[2137.58 --> 2138.44]  a unique approach.
[2138.86 --> 2139.48]  Well, there's that
[2139.48 --> 2140.34]  if you don't mind getting lost.
[2140.42 --> 2141.00]  That's a feature.
[2141.42 --> 2142.16]  Yeah, for Brent.
[2142.64 --> 2143.48]  The thing I liked
[2143.48 --> 2144.58]  about the OpenStreetMaps app
[2144.58 --> 2145.56]  is that you could download
[2145.56 --> 2146.52]  your maps offline.
[2146.70 --> 2147.24]  Hold on a minute.
[2147.50 --> 2148.04]  Hold on a minute.
[2148.96 --> 2149.68]  OSM and Plus
[2149.68 --> 2150.84]  is $25.
[2152.04 --> 2152.74]  That's quite a lot,
[2152.80 --> 2153.06]  isn't it,
[2153.06 --> 2153.46]  for an app?
[2153.76 --> 2154.20]  Well, you know,
[2154.30 --> 2156.42]  it's not $25 for me
[2156.42 --> 2157.26]  when I get it from
[2157.26 --> 2157.96]  F-Droid.
[2158.62 --> 2159.78]  Ah, there you go,
[2159.82 --> 2160.12]  you see.
[2161.70 --> 2162.44]  I've been using
[2162.44 --> 2163.04]  ViewRanger
[2163.04 --> 2164.40]  for quite a number
[2164.40 --> 2164.72]  of years.
[2164.78 --> 2165.68]  Whenever I take a hike
[2165.68 --> 2166.50]  or something like that,
[2166.60 --> 2166.88]  I actually,
[2167.14 --> 2168.24]  this is a very
[2168.24 --> 2169.12]  long-term usage
[2169.12 --> 2169.62]  for me
[2169.62 --> 2170.92]  from back
[2170.92 --> 2171.58]  when I lived in England.
[2171.58 --> 2173.52]  It supports things
[2173.52 --> 2174.76]  like Ordnance Survey Maps
[2174.76 --> 2175.66]  and you can download
[2175.66 --> 2177.16]  US Geological Survey Maps.
[2177.26 --> 2178.02]  You can buy them
[2178.02 --> 2179.58]  and actually buy the tiles
[2179.58 --> 2181.00]  directly in ViewRanger.
[2181.54 --> 2182.78]  They're changing their name
[2182.78 --> 2184.10]  to Outdoor Active
[2184.10 --> 2185.96]  so you can find them
[2185.96 --> 2186.92]  at ViewRanger.com.
[2187.22 --> 2188.20]  I've found that one
[2188.20 --> 2188.62]  pretty good.
[2189.18 --> 2190.02]  Brent there mentioned
[2190.02 --> 2190.70]  F-Droid.
[2191.16 --> 2192.44]  We got several people,
[2192.62 --> 2193.42]  including Ross,
[2193.48 --> 2194.36]  who wrote in and said,
[2194.48 --> 2195.58]  I like the Aurora Store.
[2196.00 --> 2196.68]  It's an alternative
[2196.68 --> 2197.90]  front-end for Google Play
[2197.90 --> 2199.14]  which keeps your data away
[2199.14 --> 2200.08]  while giving you access
[2200.08 --> 2200.78]  to those apps
[2200.78 --> 2201.54]  that are exclusive.
[2202.98 --> 2203.46]  He's like,
[2203.50 --> 2203.98]  that's the only way
[2203.98 --> 2205.08]  I could get the Starlink app.
[2205.96 --> 2206.64]  I will admit,
[2206.78 --> 2208.24]  I have Aurora Droid installed
[2208.24 --> 2209.00]  and I prefer it
[2209.00 --> 2209.48]  over F-Droid
[2209.48 --> 2210.50]  most of the time.
[2210.80 --> 2211.16]  It has a few
[2211.16 --> 2211.92]  little tiny bugs,
[2212.04 --> 2212.58]  but I didn't know
[2212.58 --> 2213.28]  that was a feature,
[2213.46 --> 2214.20]  so that's great to hear.
[2214.62 --> 2215.80]  Ross says that he switched
[2215.80 --> 2217.14]  to ProtonMail from Gmail
[2217.14 --> 2218.66]  and I've used ProtonMail
[2218.66 --> 2219.48]  and I like it a lot.
[2220.72 --> 2221.68]  So there's something there.
[2222.46 --> 2223.30]  There was also,
[2223.56 --> 2224.90]  a lot of people wrote in
[2224.90 --> 2225.88]  about their different approaches
[2225.88 --> 2226.94]  to contact syncing
[2226.94 --> 2227.76]  and Brent,
[2227.80 --> 2228.30]  did you cover
[2228.30 --> 2229.06]  in last week's episode
[2229.06 --> 2229.60]  how you do that?
[2229.78 --> 2230.32]  I think I did,
[2230.38 --> 2231.00]  but I'll do it again.
[2231.34 --> 2232.30]  I'm using NextCloud
[2232.30 --> 2233.08]  for contact syncing
[2233.08 --> 2234.16]  and I've found that
[2234.16 --> 2235.50]  to be pretty bulletproof actually.
[2235.66 --> 2236.66]  I was worried at first
[2236.66 --> 2237.82]  when I did it a while ago
[2237.82 --> 2239.36]  because contacts
[2239.36 --> 2241.44]  is arguably the thing
[2241.44 --> 2242.46]  that's most important to me
[2242.46 --> 2244.12]  getting all of that right
[2244.12 --> 2245.32]  and it's been bulletproof.
[2246.20 --> 2247.04]  Well, Dale writes in,
[2247.14 --> 2248.66]  I just listened to episode 51
[2248.66 --> 2250.46]  and I think Brent mentioned
[2250.46 --> 2251.12]  NextCloud.
[2251.54 --> 2252.46]  Yes, confirmed.
[2252.66 --> 2253.64]  We just had that confirmed
[2253.64 --> 2254.02]  by Brent.
[2254.10 --> 2254.44]  Thank you.
[2254.98 --> 2256.20]  And I wondered if any of you
[2256.20 --> 2258.06]  have heard or used Etsy Sync,
[2258.10 --> 2260.16]  that's E-T-E-Sync.com.
[2260.54 --> 2262.12]  It's a self-hostable project
[2262.12 --> 2263.24]  whose value proposition
[2263.24 --> 2264.18]  is secure,
[2264.40 --> 2265.42]  end-to-end encrypted
[2265.42 --> 2267.44]  and privacy respecting sync
[2267.44 --> 2268.20]  for your contacts,
[2268.42 --> 2268.84]  calendars,
[2269.02 --> 2270.24]  tasks and notes.
[2270.66 --> 2271.56]  I've been using it
[2271.56 --> 2272.88]  for about two years now
[2272.88 --> 2274.24]  and more recently
[2274.24 --> 2274.94]  I've been using it
[2274.94 --> 2275.84]  on my GNOME desktop.
[2275.84 --> 2276.98]  I pay for them
[2276.98 --> 2277.90]  to manage the hosting
[2277.90 --> 2278.42]  and syncing
[2278.42 --> 2279.30]  but you could absolutely
[2279.30 --> 2280.14]  host it yourself.
[2280.58 --> 2281.58]  Highly recommend it.
[2281.70 --> 2282.46]  Thanks for the great show
[2282.46 --> 2283.04]  and all the best.
[2283.30 --> 2283.52]  Dale.
[2284.58 --> 2285.72]  E-T-E-Sync.com
[2285.72 --> 2286.44]  We'll have a link to that
[2286.44 --> 2286.92]  in the show notes.
[2286.96 --> 2287.64]  I looked at it
[2287.64 --> 2289.00]  before the show
[2289.00 --> 2290.40]  and it's a solution
[2290.40 --> 2291.34]  that really is kind of
[2291.34 --> 2292.94]  targeted at just
[2292.94 --> 2295.02]  a end-to-end
[2295.02 --> 2296.40]  encrypted sync
[2296.40 --> 2297.82]  of contact calendar
[2297.82 --> 2298.48]  task notes.
[2298.60 --> 2299.38]  Like it just solves
[2299.38 --> 2300.02]  that problem.
[2300.20 --> 2301.26]  That's what they focus on.
[2301.54 --> 2302.54]  And they've got apps
[2302.54 --> 2303.66]  in the Apple App Store,
[2304.14 --> 2304.62]  Google Play,
[2304.62 --> 2305.72]  they're on F-Droid too
[2305.72 --> 2307.20]  and of course
[2307.20 --> 2307.88]  you can get it
[2307.88 --> 2308.36]  on your desktop.
[2308.90 --> 2310.32]  It looks pretty legit actually.
[2310.54 --> 2311.54]  I think I just decrypted
[2311.54 --> 2312.62]  what their name means.
[2312.76 --> 2313.48]  E-to-E-Sync
[2313.48 --> 2314.36]  is end-to-end sync
[2314.36 --> 2314.88]  isn't it?
[2315.08 --> 2316.74]  Ah, I was wondering.
[2317.08 --> 2317.42]  Duh.
[2318.58 --> 2319.42]  It's one of those moments
[2319.42 --> 2320.02]  you figure it out
[2320.02 --> 2320.38]  and you're like
[2320.38 --> 2321.48]  oh I feel like a dummy now.
[2323.18 --> 2324.18]  You know if I could
[2324.18 --> 2325.00]  mention one thing
[2325.00 --> 2325.80]  about Nextcloud
[2325.80 --> 2327.74]  on Android at least
[2327.74 --> 2328.66]  that made it
[2328.66 --> 2330.28]  possible for me
[2330.28 --> 2331.42]  and integrates it
[2331.42 --> 2332.34]  at a system level
[2332.34 --> 2332.94]  everywhere
[2332.94 --> 2334.58]  is this little app
[2334.58 --> 2335.68]  called DevX5.
[2336.06 --> 2337.46]  It takes the Nextcloud
[2337.46 --> 2337.96]  syncing
[2337.96 --> 2339.64]  which is CalDev
[2339.64 --> 2341.00]  and CardDev
[2341.00 --> 2341.96]  and just
[2341.96 --> 2342.70]  sort of
[2342.70 --> 2343.42]  makes that
[2343.42 --> 2343.96]  available
[2343.96 --> 2344.90]  at a system level
[2344.90 --> 2346.10]  in the same exact
[2346.10 --> 2346.60]  places
[2346.60 --> 2347.42]  and ways
[2347.42 --> 2348.20]  that all of the
[2348.20 --> 2349.08]  Google stuff
[2349.08 --> 2349.62]  appears
[2349.62 --> 2350.70]  so it's just seamless.
[2351.16 --> 2351.60]  So that would be
[2351.60 --> 2352.30]  a huge recommendation
[2352.30 --> 2352.88]  from me.
[2353.04 --> 2353.88]  Say it again for me.
[2355.02 --> 2355.54]  DevX5
[2355.54 --> 2357.06]  available in F-Droid
[2357.06 --> 2358.20]  and maybe
[2358.20 --> 2359.10]  in other stores.
[2359.20 --> 2359.70]  Can you put a link
[2359.70 --> 2360.22]  in the show notes
[2360.22 --> 2360.76]  for us Brent?
[2361.24 --> 2361.86]  Oh probably.
[2362.56 --> 2363.26]  So what did you guys
[2363.26 --> 2364.10]  think of the meetup?
[2364.56 --> 2365.18]  It was pretty cool
[2365.18 --> 2366.14]  to meet some of our
[2366.14 --> 2367.06]  listeners huh?
[2367.34 --> 2368.18]  Yeah we saw
[2368.18 --> 2369.16]  a Chris and the Badger
[2369.16 --> 2369.70]  shirt there
[2369.70 --> 2370.80]  which was exciting
[2370.80 --> 2371.24]  because I hadn't
[2371.24 --> 2371.86]  considered that
[2371.86 --> 2372.48]  somebody would get
[2372.48 --> 2372.96]  a shirt with the
[2372.96 --> 2373.54]  intention of bringing
[2373.54 --> 2374.08]  it to the meetup.
[2374.18 --> 2374.68]  That was great.
[2374.90 --> 2375.68]  That was Optimus Grey
[2375.68 --> 2376.36]  rocking the Chris
[2376.36 --> 2376.92]  and the Badger.
[2377.44 --> 2377.88]  Yeah I thought
[2377.88 --> 2378.52]  that was super cool.
[2378.62 --> 2379.28]  He posed for a picture
[2379.28 --> 2379.88]  with us and we had
[2379.88 --> 2380.44]  to stand on the
[2380.44 --> 2381.28]  correct sides as well.
[2381.38 --> 2381.72]  You know I was
[2381.72 --> 2382.50]  on the Badger side
[2382.50 --> 2382.96]  and you were on
[2382.96 --> 2383.56]  the Chris side.
[2383.84 --> 2383.98]  Right.
[2384.04 --> 2384.60]  My daughter thought
[2384.60 --> 2385.48]  it was so cool
[2385.48 --> 2386.10]  that people wanted
[2386.10 --> 2387.02]  to take selfies
[2387.02 --> 2387.76]  with us.
[2387.86 --> 2388.06]  So I was like
[2388.06 --> 2388.96]  really that's the
[2388.96 --> 2389.66]  thing you think
[2389.66 --> 2390.24]  is cool?
[2390.50 --> 2390.80]  Alright.
[2391.20 --> 2391.60]  Okay.
[2391.94 --> 2392.44]  Well I thought
[2392.44 --> 2393.42]  the free donuts
[2393.42 --> 2394.12]  were pretty cool.
[2394.36 --> 2395.10]  Linode put on
[2395.10 --> 2396.04]  a heck of a show
[2396.04 --> 2396.52]  for us.
[2396.78 --> 2397.54]  Yeah you know
[2397.54 --> 2398.62]  Brent and I
[2398.62 --> 2399.30]  and Wes went
[2399.30 --> 2400.30]  to grab those donuts
[2400.30 --> 2401.04]  and that was
[2401.04 --> 2401.64]  quite the journey
[2401.64 --> 2402.08]  because it was
[2402.08 --> 2403.44]  150 donuts
[2403.44 --> 2404.62]  and it was in
[2404.62 --> 2405.50]  downtown Denver
[2405.50 --> 2406.80]  during Friday
[2406.80 --> 2407.42]  rush hour.
[2407.54 --> 2407.90]  I don't know
[2407.90 --> 2408.42]  what we were
[2408.42 --> 2408.80]  thinking.
[2409.80 --> 2410.62]  And so at a
[2410.62 --> 2411.16]  certain point
[2411.16 --> 2412.12]  I saw a little
[2412.12 --> 2412.86]  bit of Canadian
[2412.86 --> 2414.06]  road rage emerge
[2414.06 --> 2414.60]  out of Brent
[2414.60 --> 2415.44]  when this truck
[2415.44 --> 2416.92]  Brent had gotten
[2416.92 --> 2417.46]  into a battle
[2417.46 --> 2418.04]  with a truck
[2418.04 --> 2418.40]  downtown
[2418.40 --> 2419.86]  and he had
[2419.86 --> 2420.18]  to kind of
[2420.18 --> 2420.56]  cut in front
[2420.56 --> 2420.94]  of the truck
[2420.94 --> 2421.64]  because a lane
[2421.64 --> 2422.14]  was ending
[2422.14 --> 2422.80]  and the truck
[2422.80 --> 2423.54]  driver never
[2423.54 --> 2424.16]  forgave him
[2424.16 --> 2424.74]  for it.
[2426.00 --> 2426.72]  Does Brent
[2426.72 --> 2427.40]  get angry?
[2427.82 --> 2428.12]  I mean
[2428.12 --> 2428.96]  disgruntled?
[2429.28 --> 2430.14]  I got slightly
[2430.14 --> 2430.72]  more aggressive
[2430.72 --> 2431.42]  in my driving.
[2431.70 --> 2431.98]  Oh wow.
[2432.28 --> 2433.06]  It was one
[2433.06 --> 2433.82]  of those situations
[2433.82 --> 2434.34]  where you just
[2434.34 --> 2434.88]  got to get over
[2434.88 --> 2435.30]  and you got to
[2435.30 --> 2435.62]  do everything
[2435.62 --> 2436.10]  you can
[2436.10 --> 2437.06]  and it wasn't
[2437.06 --> 2437.60]  too bad
[2437.60 --> 2438.40]  actually I thought
[2438.40 --> 2439.52]  but that truck
[2439.52 --> 2440.28]  decided to
[2440.28 --> 2441.94]  very aggressively
[2441.94 --> 2442.74]  pass us
[2442.74 --> 2443.18]  on the right
[2443.18 --> 2443.78]  hand side.
[2443.92 --> 2444.12]  You had to
[2444.12 --> 2444.94]  work at it too.
[2445.14 --> 2445.46]  Oh yeah.
[2445.46 --> 2446.88]  and promptly
[2446.88 --> 2447.82]  cut us off
[2447.82 --> 2449.30]  again on the
[2449.30 --> 2449.70]  left hand side.
[2449.70 --> 2450.24]  We're just trying
[2450.24 --> 2450.76]  to make a donut
[2450.76 --> 2451.06]  run.
[2451.62 --> 2452.58]  I don't think he
[2452.58 --> 2453.22]  realized what we
[2453.22 --> 2453.66]  were trying to
[2453.66 --> 2454.08]  accomplish.
[2454.38 --> 2454.72]  I know.
[2454.96 --> 2455.28]  I know.
[2455.46 --> 2456.12]  Hey before we go
[2456.12 --> 2456.54]  I want to say
[2456.54 --> 2457.30]  thank you to our
[2457.30 --> 2457.62]  members.
[2458.00 --> 2459.16]  Our SREs make
[2459.16 --> 2460.18]  this show possible.
[2460.80 --> 2461.54]  Selfhosted.show
[2461.54 --> 2462.62]  slash SRE if you'd
[2462.62 --> 2463.34]  like to sign up.
[2463.72 --> 2464.42]  You get a discount
[2464.42 --> 2465.32]  on our merch
[2465.32 --> 2466.70]  at jupitergarage.com
[2466.70 --> 2467.84]  and you get
[2467.84 --> 2468.50]  access to the
[2468.50 --> 2469.48]  exclusive post show
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[2470.32 --> 2471.08]  RSS feed
[2471.08 --> 2472.36]  at selfhosted.show
[2472.36 --> 2473.26]  slash SRE.
[2473.26 --> 2474.52]  And I want to
[2474.52 --> 2475.00]  mention you can
[2475.00 --> 2475.64]  find our sponsor
[2475.64 --> 2476.38]  at Cloud Guru
[2476.38 --> 2477.40]  on social media.
[2477.78 --> 2478.36]  Essentially any
[2478.36 --> 2479.18]  social media site
[2479.18 --> 2479.54]  they're just
[2479.54 --> 2480.44]  slash at Cloud Guru.
[2480.84 --> 2481.54]  YouTube, Twitter,
[2481.66 --> 2482.30]  the Facebooks,
[2482.38 --> 2483.10]  you know, the
[2483.10 --> 2483.68]  social medias
[2483.68 --> 2484.60]  slash at Cloud Guru.
[2485.24 --> 2485.70]  And as you all
[2485.70 --> 2486.42]  well know by this
[2486.42 --> 2486.66]  point,
[2486.82 --> 2487.80]  selfhosted.show
[2487.80 --> 2488.46]  slash contact
[2488.46 --> 2489.20]  is the place to
[2489.20 --> 2489.62]  go to get in
[2489.62 --> 2490.14]  touch with us.
[2490.30 --> 2491.32]  You can find me
[2491.32 --> 2491.82]  on Twitter
[2491.82 --> 2492.98]  at ironicbadger.
[2493.20 --> 2493.96]  I'm at Chris
[2493.96 --> 2494.48]  LAS.
[2494.94 --> 2495.98]  And I'm at
[2495.98 --> 2496.70]  Brent Jervais.
[2497.00 --> 2497.70]  And the show
[2497.70 --> 2498.34]  is at
[2498.34 --> 2499.44]  selfhosted show.
[2499.74 --> 2500.18]  Thanks for
[2500.18 --> 2500.70]  listening everyone.
[2500.70 --> 2501.20]  That was
[2501.20 --> 2502.24]  selfhosted.show
[2502.24 --> 2503.34]  slash 52.